924Board.org

[paluck]

Hi team,
We run a '79 924 in Lemons. We've been through plenty of teething issues ans last time it ran perfectly. Of course we've pretty much replaced or rehabbed every system on the car - so hopefully we're not just entering a second round...
Final point of mechanical woes is our transmission. Yes we are still running a snailshell.
First snailshell got trashed - eventually lost first gear. Cause - rear bushing linkage.
Second snailshell. A little crunchy with second, but at least all the gears worked - last event we drained the oil and a big ole roll pin fell out. We removed and parked it for possible future disassembly.
3rd snailshell - Just put in one that's been on the salvage shelf for eons - fluid drained - looked normal - replaced fluid. Works well, except:
1) 1st seems to have no synchros at all - you need to be FULLY stopped to get into first - whatever - we can deal with that.
2) Some of our drivers (like me) grind upshifting into second, but our other driver has no issues. It almost seems like a "hitting reverse clash" cause its so I'm wondering if our shifter is somehow out of alignment. Its also seems easy to accidentally hit 4th instead or maybe I'm just hamfisted... I have the 4th snailshell in the back of my truck - which will serve as a spare - we're going to run the next event (2 weeks out) with Snailshell #3

BUT my team has been talking about fabricating an external shift gate. I'm willing to give it a try, but it just sounds like more risk - trouble than its worth. and hey - we didn't seem to have this specific trouble with the last one...SO
1) Any input on an external gate fabbed up to just align 2nd and maybe have some sort of Reverse lock out?
2) Should we tear a couple open and try to make 1 good one out of a few bad ones? I have literally now have 5 transaxles (the 4 mentioned above, plus a G31 from an '80 turbo)
Would any parts from the G31 be available to retrofit the the G16?

I know you'll all want to say ditch the snailshell entirely (and I will go that route eventually if I have to) but I seem to have a steady stream of dirt cheap replacements and I am stubborn and am willing to blow at least a couple more before I throw in the towel

Thanks in advance for any input - and if anyone happens to be at Thunderhill Raceway for the Lemons event - stop by for free food and beer at our pit
_________________
paluck(at)hotmail.com
1989 944 S2
1979 924

[fiat22turbo]

You have to shift SLOWLY from first to second. Period.

From there, it should shift fairly well, but the first to second is just slow and you have to pause in the middle of the gate.

Make sure your motor mounts and transmission mounts are in good shape because the shifter being mounted to the body can cause alignment issues if the transaxle and motor are moving around. This is partly why the Audi transaxle works a bit better.

You can try filling the transaxle mounts with urethane windshield adhesive and fabricating vibratec-style motor mounts, to help reduce the movement-caused issues. If you're a fabricator, you can adapt the Audi style linkage to the snailshell to reduce the chance of misalignment due to the transaxle and shift linkage moving in different planes as well. I think there is a How-To on it.

This is why an external shift gate won't help. I've driven a Ferrari 328GTS with an external gate and a transaxle mounted in rubber. You have to pay attention to your driving to ensure you only shift up and down when driving in a straight line, if you don't, you will be stuck between gears. Why would you want to subject yourself to that sort of headache?

With my 79' I've found that I have to make sure the clutch is fully disengaged to shift from first to second along with the requesit pause mid-gate. I figured that is due to the new clutch and perhaps a slight mis-adjustment in the clutch cable.
_________________
Stefan
1979 924 Carrera GTS (clone-ish)
1988 944 Turbo S (Silver Rose)

[Cedric]

How good condition are the shift linkage bushings in?

They might be worn or else you really need to educate your team in gear changing(or something else is broken/worn). I (or my wife, or my dad) havent had any problem on track with finding correct gear during track driving, nor with G16 or G31. On very rare ocasions 5th goes in instead of third.

Dont you drive on regular tracks? I dont think I´ve ever used 2nd on a race track, except for exiting the pits. So a grinding 2nd on my G16 wasnt really a problem on track, especially if you learn the "heel toe dubbel clutch dance", then you can smoothly downshift with pretty much anything

I recently filled my gearb box mounts with PU on the 931 when I had the box down for refurb, seems to be much stiffer. I already have vibratechs on the engine, they make a lot of difference in having the drivetrain sitting still
_________________
1980 924 Turbo
www.instagram.com/garagecedric/

[paluck]

Ah - good information - thank you both. Last time we changed the tranny, we swapped in a spare that already had mounts on its - maybe these mounts are more worn than the ones we had previously. I'll investigate shoring up the mounting.
Reason we need 1st and second is because its LeMons - you're on track with 170 other cars, so - at times there is so much traffic you need to literally come to a crawl.
_________________
paluck(at)hotmail.com
1989 944 S2
1979 924

[ideola]

You will never get a snailshell to downshift reliably into 1st unless you completely rebuild it and put all fresh synchros and dogrings, which will put you out of range Lemons budget. You would be better off switching to an Audi-based gearbox if you need 1st.
_________________
erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

[fiat22turbo]

ChumpCar allows you to rebuild parts to factory specs without taking a hit to your budget, provided you do the work yourself.

A team in Portland ran a Volvo 145 Wagon with 14:1 CR because they did the machine work themselves. I ran on a team that had a rebuilt motor, using factory parts (still spit a rocker arm due to an over aggressive driver over-revving the motor on a downshift)

They want cars on the course and butts in the seats.

I don't know about that Fruity series though as I've not paid attention to their rules.

With that said, a rebuild would likely blow your personal budget and many gear boxes don't like to downshift to 1st very often when the car is in motion. Many have to be very nearly stopped to engage 1st.
_________________
Stefan
1979 924 Carrera GTS (clone-ish)
1988 944 Turbo S (Silver Rose)

[Rasta Monsta]

Stefan is right, 1-2 shift on a snail box is two steps. 1 to N. N to 2. My snail is in perfect shape, but if you jam it forward trying to get 2nd, you will likely catch a whiff of reverse on your way there.

Oh, and it's an enduro, for Chris' sake! Don't shift like you are driving a quarter mile!
_________________
Toofah King Bad

• WeiBe (1987 924S 2.5t) - 931 S3

[fiat22turbo]

[paluck]

just an update for folks - we just ran the transmission as is and we quickly got the hang of it and the shifts really presented no issues. We'll probably fill in those mounts to crisp it up - but this tranny survived the event intact. Much more than could be said of our exhaust (R.I.P.).
But our exhaust system failures seem mostly due to other cars trying to park inside of it
_________________
paluck(at)hotmail.com
1989 944 S2
1979 924