924Board.org

[Warped]

Well the moment of truth came and went with absolutly nothing happening...

I tried to start my car, and nothing happened. It's like it still isn't getting power from the ignition to the engine. Nothing turned, and I didn't hear any sounds of anything trying to turn either.

What should I took at now? Could it be that I have the spark plug wires on the distributor wrong? The manual says to mark them, and put them back correctly when replacing them (Which I tried to do, but could I have still messed up somewhere, could they have been on there wrong from the previous owner? How would I know?)

Do I also now have to buy a lot more equipment to test my system, and each wire? Or could the alternator be bad?

Please send me your ideas

Thanks...

[924RACR]

Did the dash lights light up? If not, your ignition switch is not working - hotwire it.

If they are, but it's not cranking, then you need to deal with that first. I assume you're jump-starting it? Check that the big starter cable is good - clean the connection at the battery and at the starter with a wire brush and WD-40 to remove rust, and put them back on tight. Loose will not do. You might also be suffering from a bad ground - pretty common. Clean and tighten the ground straps - battery to body, and the engine (at the rear of the intake manifold) to the firewall. When trying to jumpstart, connect the negative lead to the engine block or a lifting eye, not the battery, that'll help. I do recommend you plan on replacing those big wires (the grounds and the starter cable) first thing - makes a huge improvement on reliability.

Firing order is stamped on the cam cover, 1-3-4-2. #1 cylinder should be connected to the distributor cap at the bottom-most lead (closest to driver's side), and then proceed around the cap clockwise. However, if the engine's not even turning, that's not your problem - yet.

Don't even worry about the alternator until you've got the engine running and the battery cables and ground straps replaced.

It wouldn't hurt to make sure the inside of the distributor cap is clean - use brake cleaner and a clean paper towel, and make sure you don't leave any residue in there.

Once you've got the engine turning over we can worry about getting it to fire, and getting it running right. Most likely there could be some issues with the ignition system; at worst case, a bad coil, but more likely just some cleaning of wires and contacts, and fiddling with the ignition timing to get it running properly. However, that comes after you've got it cranking.

Finally, your question about buying more equipment. If you've got the basic hand tools, you need no more at the moment to get it running - just the help of the board. We can help troubleshoot it. A digital multimeter is highly advised for troubleshooting electrical problems, and can be purchased at Radio Shack or a hardware store for about $20-30. It's money well spent. But like I said, you should not need this immediately

_________________
Vaughan Scott
Webmeister
'79 924 #77 SCCA H Prod racecar
'82 931 Plat. Silver
#25 Hidari Firefly P2 sports prototype

[ltgland]

I had a starting problem today, see my thread

Starting problem - HELP

for what happened, it should give you some ideas to check

[Warped]

Thanks guys,

I'll double check everything later this afternoon or evening.

It does sounds like the firing order is wrong after all? I'll double check with the what is stamped on the cam, like you said. I didn't get any dash board lights to come on either..so I'll check both of these items first tonight.

I have replaced all the ground and battery cables so I don't think that is the problem, but I will make sure they are on tight.

Thanks guys, I also saw the other similar post this morning, after I posted mine, so I'll check those items listed in that post. One way or another I'll get this working, may just take a little longer then I hoped. (I knew this wasn't going to be easy)

[Benski]

Warped,

I'm a little confused by your post. You make it sound like the engine wasn't even turning over, but the solutions you offered made me think it was turning over but it wasn't firing.

Was the engine doing anything at all or did you just get a starter "click" and nothing else.

There's a big difference between "not turning over" (ie the starter isn't engaging) and "turning over but not firing" (the starter is engaging but either the fuel or spark doesn't work)

If the starter is not engaging, then it's certainly not the plug wires (they're not even getting a chance to work).

Let us know,
Ben

[AznDrgn]

Make sure the engine is grounded. If everything checks out and the engine isn't grounded the starter will not turn.

[Warped]

Sorry, being new, also means that I have to learn the right terminology

Yes, nothing happened at all, no sounds, and no clicks...So you think that it could be my starter then?

How would I know?

Thanks,
Warped

[Guest]

Check your battery first... then connections to the battery. Follow down to the starter. Let us know from there.

[Benski]

Couple of things.

First thing to check is the ignition switch. Feel behind the dash, there should something plugged in to the ignition switch. I'm not sure how to test the ignition switch. They do wear out but for now just make sure it's connected.

Assuming it's not the ignition switch, there's really only a few things that could be wrong.

Keep in mind the flow of current is
battery->starter->alternator->ground

1) Your battery could be dead
2) The connection from the battery to the starter is bad
3) the starter is bad
4) the connection(s) from the starter to the alternator are bad
5) the connection from the alternator to ground is bad
6) ground isn't getting back to the battery

Solutions (Save 3 until last =)
1: try a different battery or jump-start
2: You said you replaced this one already. Just double check the connection at the starter. I remember this one being a pain to hook up so maybe it's not touching all the way
3: replace the starter. these starters are big meaty and tough so it's rare that they die
4: This one seems the most likely. I believe it's two cables. I think there are two just for redunancy's sake.
5: It grounds near the alternator mount on the block.
6: It's a good idea to run a cable from where the black battery cable ends to the engine block. This solved all sorts of problems for me.

Good luck! and be sure to disconnect the battery before you mess around with the connections.

[Warped]

Yes!!!!

Semi Success...I messed around with the battery and the cables, and made sure they were grounded well.

Now, I've got the car almost starting, but not totally firing. (Its like it is trying to start, but just doesn't get there all the way.) I also have lights, and power to the dash board. (I'll continue to check fuses, and the material that was in some of the other posts.)

Also I got some engine quick staring spray that I'm to spray on the carburetor. I hate to ask this, becuase it shows you all how green I am, but just where is that? I'm looking all through the Haynes manual and can not find anything listed as the carburetor (At least not in the index, appendix, or diagrams within the engine section (Chapter 1))

Thanks again, at least I'm making progress!

[Smoothie]

Stop toying with us Warped. We all know you know there is no carburator.

[Benski]

Congrats on the progress =)

That's because the 924 engine is fuel injected and not carbeuretted (i don't I spelled that right =)

Your best bet is to undo the air filter housing like you're going to change the air filter. Take out the air filter and spray in there.

One note as you try to get it started , and I know this from experience, whatever you do, don't mess with the ignition timing until you've eliminated everything else. Timing can only be set when the engine is running, and if you mess with the timing only to figure out something else is preventing it from starting then you're left with bad timing and it's difficult to reset to the proper position.

-Ben

ps:
when it's cranking, do you hear the cylinders firing every once in a while or is it just chugging?

[Smoothie]

See that Warped, we're all so disassociated from carburetors, we can't even spell it right (I copied your spelling here).

Carefull with that spray starter stuff. If you get a backfire while you're holding that can in there and spraying it you could get toasted. I once had an air filter catch fire like that. Definitely do it outdoors.

[Warped]

Thanks guys, it is all becoming clear now

I believe that they are almost firing. It sounds just like a normal start of a car, but it then quickly turns into a chugging sound.

Let me go try to spray in the air filter compartment, and come back on line, and let you know if it worked.

Thanks agian

[Pat]

How do you fit the 924 inside Smoothie? I tried flipping mine sideways and it still wouldnt fit through my living room door


[ This Message was edited by: Pat on 2002-04-21 13:38 ]