924Board.org

Tiny · Joined: 10 Apr 2006 Posts: 502 Location: London, UK

Hi folks,

Am fitting new front brake discs(rotors), wheel bearings, pads, and brake lines, and a caliper refresh.

Trying to get the old rubber brake hoses off, but when I turn the wrench on the rubber hose end....I can see the hard metal brake line wants to twist also.

I was thinking there should be a point inbetween the lower hard metal brake line union, and the upper rubber brake line end where I can use an open ended wrench to keep the copper brake line from twisting. If there was it's all been rounded off, just like the PO has done to the caliper's mangled and rusted nipple.

I wanted to use a torch on the rubber brake hose's end, but not being able to undo the nipple made me think it was safer not to, as the expanding fluid could blow the old rubber hose in my face.

I guess unless there is another way, I will cut the old rubber hose, and then undo the hard metal brake line. This will then enable me to use heat and force to crack the thing open.

Any other ideas guys?
thanks!
Tiny
_________________
*****1981 - 924 - Auto - London, UK******

Rich H · Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2009 5:07 am Post subject:

Replace the hard lines - it's not hard.

_________________
1994 Lotus Esprit S4 - Work in progress...
1980 Porsche 924 S2 DITC Turbo - Original spec
1978 Homo-Sapiens - Tired spec
1953 Landrover S1 - Pensioner Spec

CorsePerVita · Joined: 25 Jul 2008 Posts: 1992 Location: Redmond, Oregon

Where it has rounded off - have you tried a pair of vice grips on them? If you can take an old rubber glove or a shop towel in some vice grips, and sit that puppy tight as you can to hold onto it, you can probably get enough force to hold it still while you work on the other end.

Try some PB blaster on it and let it sit for an hour first, give it a try, pb blast it, give it a try again.
_________________
- 1977 Porsche 924 2.0 N/A (Trackday Project)
- 1979 Porsche 924 2.0 N/A (The other daily)
- 1980 Porsche 931 (Daily)
- 1987 Lamborghini Jalpa
- 1999 Ducati 900SS

9XX Girl! · Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2009 5:37 am Post subject:

Are you sure they are copper?
I was shocked when i looked at mine. The pipes are steel and still ok. Amazing after 25 years on English roads. I know from working in car factories, steel are fitted during production as standard in order to keep costs down. When they rust, years down the line, they get replaced with copper at your expense not theirs by the dealer or service centre.

Take the whole pipe off and take it to your local motor factors. They will have all the flaring tools and such.
They will make you one with the approx bends in. All you will need to do is fit it! “Proper Job” and its not too costly.

If you fancy a go yourself - this is where i get my stuff from.
http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.eu/VWP-onlinestore/brakepipe/brakes.php

If you quote the part number at a porsche dealer and they can find one, they will supply you it with all the stickers on but, it will be steel.
_________________
924 (84) N/A 2 ltr - 5 Speed - BLACK - Project (looking for 200BHP, any ideas!)
924 (81) N/A 2 ltr - 3 Speed Auto - SURINAM RED (Metallic) - Near Original Spec (sticking with originality)
BOTH ON THE ROAD, BOTH USED EVERY-OTHER DAY

v8carreragts · Joined: 05 Sep 2003 Posts: 665 Location: Tucson, AZ

The lines should be steel. Copper cannot be used as it will rupture from the pressures produced in the brake system.

They are just rusted. You should replace them all.

9XX Girl! · Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2009 10:19 am Post subject:

That’s interesting. Will look into that. Most cars i have had in the past, I fitted copper or copper-nickel . As long as it conforms to BS2871 it will pass a UK annual mandatory Ministry Of Transport saftey test (MOT) . I live opposite a MOT test centre; they let me use their lift. I will ask if my Porsche is ok.
I’ve never seen steel aftermarket tube for sale in a motor factors and I have been making up brake pipes for my cars for 25years.

Do porsche systens run at a higher pressure than other cars then?
_________________
924 (84) N/A 2 ltr - 5 Speed - BLACK - Project (looking for 200BHP, any ideas!)
924 (81) N/A 2 ltr - 3 Speed Auto - SURINAM RED (Metallic) - Near Original Spec (sticking with originality)
BOTH ON THE ROAD, BOTH USED EVERY-OTHER DAY

v8carreragts · Joined: 05 Sep 2003 Posts: 665 Location: Tucson, AZ

Can't buy copper or copper nickel brake line here in the states. You can only get steel and stainless.

It has against the law here to use anything copper since the early 50's.

9XX Girl! · Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2009 10:42 am Post subject:

You are wrong so wrong.

You cannot use copper in the US but it is the tube of choice in the UK

Tiny is in the UK so stop giving him wrong advive.

AS LONG AS IT CONFORMS TO BS2871

See...
http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20081001100226AAX0qb2

Go ahead "Tiny" make your pipes.

Pros and cons of different materials here
http://www.austinhealeywood.com/brakestory.html

Consumables and tooling to English speck here
http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.eu/VWP-onlinestore/brakepipe/brakes.php

Go argue with the British Ministry Of Transport v8carreragts!
_________________
924 (84) N/A 2 ltr - 5 Speed - BLACK - Project (looking for 200BHP, any ideas!)
924 (81) N/A 2 ltr - 3 Speed Auto - SURINAM RED (Metallic) - Near Original Spec (sticking with originality)
BOTH ON THE ROAD, BOTH USED EVERY-OTHER DAY

v8carreragts · Joined: 05 Sep 2003 Posts: 665 Location: Tucson, AZ

Ok so the UK uses copper.

Porsche didn't build cars with different materials just for the UK (maybe you should study the Porsche PET) so unless someone made all new lines for his car they are steel. Besides copper does not rust, it corrodes and it is very easy to tell the difference.

I don't need to argue with the Ministry of Transport because I am not in the UK. There is the DOT here and it is useless to argue with them.

9XX Girl! · Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2009 11:17 am Post subject:

If i may quote myself

Min · Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2009 4:13 pm Post subject:

Min · Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2009 4:27 pm Post subject:

Apparently this company sells it http://www.brakequip.com/tubes.html in the states they call it 'ezibend' and claim it exceeds dot standards.

Min
_________________
Custom means it didn't come from a box.
1980 n/a with EDIS and Megasquirt II Injection. 7 different colors and counting.

Kroggers · Joined: 18 Jun 2008 Posts: 102 Location: Stockholm & London

I do not want to get involved in an argument on what is available where, but here in Sweden you can get both steel and copper pipes. copper or copper variants are the most common ones for DIY jobs and road cars. For racing you are not permitted to use copper and all lines must be steel, so you can get the steel lines from specialist racing and high-performance suppliers.
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Kroggers
CoolCavaRacing.com

1983 924 (aka Scruffy)
1978 911SC (aka Wanda)

Rich H · Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2009 4:44 pm Post subject:

Tiny · Joined: 10 Apr 2006 Posts: 502 Location: London, UK

Morning All,

Thanks so much for all the input. It's really appreciated.

The hard lines must have been replaced already as they are all too good a condition and have been coated/weather protected. Nice.

I've taken a pic outlining of the part that I can't get a turn on:

Have seen it's the same on the other side so someone's had a go and messed it up. Anyway no time to be monkeying around.

I'm gonna chop the flexi hose above then remove the hard line end below, and then go at it with a torch and some vise grips

thanks again everyone
Tiny
_________________
*****1981 - 924 - Auto - London, UK******