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Old topic but lets give it a try again...BOOST Controller
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More BOOST, how? Vote on your choice
Bigger wastegate spring/shimming
14%
 14%  [ 4 ]
Higher compression pistons
3%
 3%  [ 1 ]
wastegate controller
77%
 77%  [ 21 ]
Toulene (for Rick, :'))
3%
 3%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 27

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Smoothie  



Joined: 01 Jan 2003
Posts: 8029
Location: DE (the one near MD, PA, NJ)

PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2003 8:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm in agreement there - actually have the same arrangement with the valve in the engine compartment and plumbed into that same line (as 81Turbo). Even had what looks like the same valve until a few weeks ago.. While troubleshooting, I swapped it out and put in a Parker valve. (It didn't solve my prob, so that other valve is still good.) When I first set it up years ago, I used a Parker valve (yellow knob). It worked fine for years, but vibrations eventually helped it to unscrew itself and it popped apart and pieces were lost. I then replaced that with the black valve like 81Turbo is using. So, just a note - if you install one, check it occasionally for looseness. My valve rests right on top of the valve cover though, so it gets vibrations about as bad as they can be. I got that first Parker valve from Northern Hydraulics and the current one from either there or Harbor Freight. Once it's in and adjusted properly, it's pretty accurate. Takes quite a few test runs to get it right, then you just leave it alone - that's easy to do if it's in the engine compartment. For the adjusting process though, it would be easier to have it within reach under the dash.
The black valve that I recently removed, I got at Home Depot - found it in the hand tools area. Also look near the air compressors if you're going there. It came in a yellow package along with a small air pressure gauge. (Had the brand name "Amflo" on it, from Bridge products. The valve itself has the name "Bridge" on it and the gauge says "Stanley Bostich". It was in the $20-$25 range.) Just install without the gauge.
_________________
"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."
- shamwow guy

'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox


Last edited by Smoothie on Mon Jan 13, 2003 10:39 am; edited 7 times in total
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Smoothie  



Joined: 01 Jan 2003
Posts: 8029
Location: DE (the one near MD, PA, NJ)

PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2003 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also have a homemade water injection system. It uses the Porsche headlight washer pump that attaches to and takes fluid right from the windshield washer reservoir. I made a nozzle out of copper tubing and some fittings and have a small fuel filter filtering the fluid to it. The nozzle is attached through the air filter box and sprays toward the air metering plate. I have a pressure switch to activate the pump at 5psi boost. (the system is currently out of service because I need to replace that switch) When it's working, I just top off the reservoir with regular old blue windshield washer fluid at each gas tank fillup. This setup introduces the water before the turbo - I hear this can cause some wear on the compressor blades, so you might prefer to locate the nozzle downstream of the turbo instead. I haven't seen any damage to my compressor blades though.
_________________
"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."
- shamwow guy

'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox


Last edited by Smoothie on Mon Jan 13, 2003 10:59 am; edited 1 time in total
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Smoothie  



Joined: 01 Jan 2003
Posts: 8029
Location: DE (the one near MD, PA, NJ)

PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2003 9:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[url=http://photos.msn.com/viewing/album.aspx?m7A!X9U3q6bynoZEhFj0U*w9oI3gIv7Tm9a1IOuoiC61N*n2nImicgyFBfQTSKjLgfRZ7iLfiCV*DlbHox2jfC0*luXwqTUQwT*6rg7Vvo0PEga3m!zGSw$$]Pics of water injection and boost valve (click)[/url]

First time using MSN Photos - let me know if any trouble viewing. Thx
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"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."
- shamwow guy

'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox
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Smoothie  



Joined: 01 Jan 2003
Posts: 8029
Location: DE (the one near MD, PA, NJ)

PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2003 4:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just updated the above link with a bunch of pics showing the "seamlessly integrated" water injection, boost valves, gauges, 944 e-brake handle and other assorted stuff that's been done over the years.
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"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."
- shamwow guy

'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox
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lordam  



Joined: 31 Dec 2002
Posts: 45
Location: Perth, Western Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2003 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

a lot of the discussion (all?) about 931 boost control talks about taking the pressure signal from the pipes between the turbo and the throttle body. Has anyone experimented with taking the pressure lines for the wastegate from the intake manifold between the throttle body and the head?

If you are maximum boost with the throttle held open for "long" periods then there is probably not much difference. But if you are looking for fast response from changes in the throttle (AX?) in the turbo engine, then the pressure changes and their effect on resetting the wastegate when off maximum boost would be greater if the control line was plumbed off the intake manifold.

John
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924martinirossi  



Joined: 04 Nov 2002
Posts: 605
Location: Seattle, Washington, USA

PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://photos.msn.com/viewing/album.aspx?m7A!X9U3q6bynoZEhFj0U*w9oI3gIv7Tm9a1IOuoiC61N*n2nImicgyFBfQTSKjLgfRZ7iLfiCV*DlbHox2jfC0*luXwqTUQwT*6rg7Vvo0PEga3m!zGSw$$

Can anybody ID the two relays above the DITC? (Picture 23 at Smoothies site)

Michael
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Smoothie  



Joined: 01 Jan 2003
Posts: 8029
Location: DE (the one near MD, PA, NJ)

PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2003 3:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've heard a few guesses on what they're for. One way to find out would be to unplug one, see what stops working, then do the other.
On my car, the one toward the front is for the radio and the other's for power windows.

I updated the comments on pic #24.
Here's just [url=http://photos.msn.com/viewing/photo.aspx?GXjoJRPv*Lq8VA9E0sByrKOS3zy2BjeUuw5NU3ajFedIYUBiMJPKQkpEu5zH9c*aNC*68KOHc6KghhSjyC1I!zeWHIQ8G!x02SyeYb88!ZMJxB1SoSVEsw$$]<the pic>[/url].
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"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."
- shamwow guy

'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox
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Smoothie  



Joined: 01 Jan 2003
Posts: 8029
Location: DE (the one near MD, PA, NJ)

PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2003 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anywho.. I put my boost control and water injection back in service.
Zooming around now with boost at about 10psi - Smoothie's happy...
This time, to keep the valve from vibrating itself apart, I unscrewed and put a couple drops of super glue on the threads, then tightened it back up. (This went on the bonnet-to-body threads - not the valve adjustment threads. )

Next detail will be to replace the water injection nozzle. I have a couple of "Fogg-it" water misting nozzles from AM Leonard (garden stuff retailer) - one is fine, the other is super fine. Each has 3 small removable nozzles in the end, so I'll be able to take one and assemble it into a new nozzle arrangement that'll have a nice fine spray pattern.
https://www.amleo.com/item.cgi?cmd=view&Words=fog
http://www.americanclayworks.net/new%20products%20folder%20/dramm_fogg_it_nozzle.html
http://www.carlinsales.com/page.cfm/223
_________________
"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."
- shamwow guy

'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox
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Smoothie  



Joined: 01 Jan 2003
Posts: 8029
Location: DE (the one near MD, PA, NJ)

PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2003 4:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Got myself a round tuit and updated the water injection nozzle. The 3 small nozzles that make up a [url=http://photos.msn.com/viewing/photo.aspx?GXjoJRPv*Lq8VA9E0sByrKOS3zy2BjeUuw5NU3ajFefNQoiNHy00HOawE32Qd8Z3s5Fu1cdPkAzLgG7WHPs7LEr0RNYRehyOPqp1fyhIEgudYU4mNFr!WA$$]<Fogg-It nozzle>[/url] are press-fit and ~.42" diameter [url=http://photos.msn.com/viewing/photo.aspx?GXjoJRPv*Lq8VA9E0sByrKOS3zy2BjeUuw5NU3ajFefx2tt5HOS7*89UUZKrOOD12Vgu8onBSYbTYJZAEtFnlGC!K9PnUpQMuXoFIiUI*oR4G6lFlAo5bA$$]<pic>[/url]. I drilled a fitting to that size (27/64") on the drill press and pressed in a nozzle and assembled it with fittings I already had laying around. The whole 3 nozzle super-fine Fogg-It is rated at 1/2 GPM at 40 psi, so just one of them would be 1/6 GPM. It's putting out quite a bit more [url=http://photos.msn.com/viewing/photo.aspx?GXjoJRPv*Lq8VA9E0sByrKOS3zy2BjeUuw5NU3ajFeegrILSKw22mMqmcVfVWt5BKHrdEQWZJw21SdtCLg5cvoAo9FLThi2qNT!ndSymi1EGYeDLA0kirg$$]<pic>[/url] than the old homemade nozzle, but I'll just leave it for a while and see how much water it goes through... With the old nozzle, it averaged a little over a gallon of water per tankfull of gas with my usual style of street driving.
For a little extra insurance I added a [url=http://photos.msn.com/viewing/photo.aspx?GXjoJRPv*Lq8VA9E0sByrKOS3zy2BjeUuw5NU3ajFecuGc0!ZPagay3oLgmg5Eyi9K7C8H*j8aTJu4kv1IM9cMm18iOIw7cOrOGSH7UuSZVsqHXtRDlxhw$$]<screen>[/url] between the nozzle and air metering plate. Not that I do sloppy work - just for some peace of mind in case something should loosen and fall off.
_________________
"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."
- shamwow guy

'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox
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-nick  



Joined: 16 Nov 2002
Posts: 2700
Location: Cambridge, MA

PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2003 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i've read this thread a couple times and i'm not sure which way to go on the controller.

seems that using a valve between the intake and control line will avoid the wastegate creep problem; the valve wouldn't open until the boost hits the predetermined pressure, then it opens and the wastegate opens all at once.

and on the other hand using a regulator on the vent side allows easy plumbing into the cockpit, and easy plumbing in general. but now you've got the wastegate opening slightly before you hit peak boost.

have i got all this straight?

-nick
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numbbers  



Joined: 05 Nov 2002
Posts: 1910
Location: Highlands Ranch, Colorado

PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2003 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Guys, you can worry about wastegate creep all you want, but if you just install the five dollar valve at the charge tube you will get all of the boost you want with little hassle. I have been running 17 PSI for several years using an air compressor tool control valve, and as soon as the boost comes on at all, it zips right to 17. That doesn't mean that I don't have any turbo lag. Under 3K I have little to any boost. But, as soon as the boost kicks in, I get it all.
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