924Board.org

[Fasteddie313]

[slowcarfast]

I'm also pretty new to the 924, having got my first (and current) one in November of 2019, so I'm by no means an expert on the model. That said, $7500 CDN sounds very aspirational for this car to me as well. But that certainly doesn't mean you shouldn't take a look and drive it. It's all part of your research program. Regarding the interior: that's certainly an area where Porsche compromised on these cars. The plastics they used were just not very durable. You almost cannot find a 924 that doesn't have a dash cracked all to heck. But it's all fixable. Slap a dash cap on, and when you have the means, pull the dash and take it to a good auto upholsterer.

Others more experienced correct me if they know better: For the US/Canada, '77.5 models benefited from increased compression, revised timing, and a different cam to increase HP and torque to something a bit closer to European specs (from Morgan book). He also mentions steps taken in the '77 model year to address vapor lock issues. Beginning in '78 the bodyshells were completely galvanized, as opposed to only the lower portion previously. For '77 the model got a dogleg 5-speed and then in '80 a conventional layout 5-speed. So as is the way with Porsche, continual improvement. I don't want to dis anyone's '76, but it does sound like significant improvements were made over the next few years. (Original Porsche 924/944/968 by Peter Morgan is a good source for learning about these cars).

The 931 (that's the insider way of referring to the 924 Turbo ) gets a lot of love on this forum, I'm sure for good reason, but I think even those folks would concede that it is a more complex car than the NA, and maybe not the best for someone who is just starting out to learn to work on their classic. Also maybe more issues to look out for when shopping for one.

You've probably figured out by now that the 924S and the 944 are also significantly more complicated than the 2.0L 924. Doing a timing belt on a 924S is a lot harder than it is on a 924, for example. The 924S sounds like a fantastic car, with the clean lines and light weight of the 924 combined with the better power and torque of the 2.5L Porsche engine. Downside: not as easy for the hobbyist to work on.

The general consensus here seems to be that parts are easy to get for these cars, but I have to say that I've found parts availability to not be as good as I thought it would be. There is a lot more after-market support for the 924S/944 than there is for the early 924. And my other comparison point would be my MG Midget. Despite the fact that the last one was factory produced 40 years ago, you could literally build one from scratch with mostly new parts (including bodyshell!) and the rest used off Ebay. Maybe that's an extreme example, but there's stuff for the 924 that's very difficult to find (and as already mentioned, some unobtainium). That said, I'm sure everyone here would still say the 924 is a good choice for a first classic. And it's certainly the most affordable Porsche, though I guess you can get an early Boxter for $10K. Have fun working on that yourself.

Regarding the hobby/life advice/should you even be doing this?: I think you should, assuming you like to drive. What I know about working on cars (not a whole lot!) is 100% self-taught. I did not have the advantage of a close family member or friend who knew about working on cars to teach me. But I do love to drive and eventually I got to the point of wanting a simple car I could use to teach myself about how they actually work. A good friend of mine who is a Spridget lover easily convinced me to get one, and working on and driving my Midget for the last 18 years has been incredibly rewarding and enjoyable. I'm not hijacking this thread to push a Midget on you; both it and the 924 are in the same family: simple, inexpensive, totally analog, driver-focused, sports cars. That's why I was attracted to the 924. And I can drive it in the rain! As everyone on this forum I'm sure would agree, there's nothing like driving such a car, where there is such clear feedback to the driver from the machine. And when it's a car you have actually worked on, when you understand exactly what is happening when you press on the go pedal or feel the car's balance on turn-in and through the apex, and when you know that you yourself have properly set the timing, valve clearances, and bled the brakes, it makes the drive that much more rewarding and enjoyable. For me a drive in either of my "fun" cars has become the best therapy I could imagine. As for headaches, I suppose it all comes down to mindset. It's a headache when the daily driver/modern car has problems, because I need that car to work on demand, and I'm not going to try to fix it when it doesn't. When there's a problem with the MG or the Porsche, that's just a fun puzzle to figure out, a challenge. And when you do get the car going again, what a great feeling.
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1981 924 Weissach Ed #187
1971 MG Midget

[peterld]

+ 1 ^^^^ So well summarised.....exactly the reasons for owning an older car.
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80/81 932/8 ROW

[D Hook]

If I were you I'd keep looking. There are much better examples out there for less money. Have you checked Craigslist? Or Ebay?

Saw a few hoses missing or cut under the hood and dash. Throws up red flags the size of Rhode Island. It might run but.....
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'80 924 n/a SOLD

[gml]

slowcarfast, thanks for the incredible response! That kind of info is exactly what I'm looking for. I am certainly considering a Midget as well since it checks the boxes for a classic experience as you said, but a 924 is 10x cooler to me (only 2x cooler than an MGB GT though). The Midget examples I've seen seem to be either great at $10K or project at under $5K, this 924 seems like a nice opportunity because its not a project and not yet a daily, and priced in that middle range.

I think you're right about the early models and their quality overall. In Canada a fully galvanized body would be a big plus, and I've always loved a dogleg shifter, so maybe I should hold out for a 78-79 example. But... I have a good feeling seller will take a lowball offer. What if I get it for under $5K CAD? Unfortunately there just aren't many listings in my region for 924s and since $7K is about the most I want to spend right now I'm priced out. (I get daily alerts from Kijiji and auto trader, but forgot about eBay).

slowcarfast, your life advice section is exactly what I needed to hear. I feel confident about learning how to fix it and since it won't be my daily driver I am excited about the puzzle aspect. I dream about driving the 924 on a summer day and to be the one responsible for getting it on the road puts a smile on my face even now. I guess the one thing that freaks me out is that I only have a pretty tight one-car garage and the driveway is on a pretty steep incline, so if it wasn't running I would have to recruit a few guys to push the thing up a small hill.

D Hook, can you elaborate a bit on what the implications of that are? What would the repair bill be?

[anthonimartini]

7500 is very high for that car. id sell you my 77 for 3500 right now and it has tons of work done to it and has been dead reliable for me. as previously said, i would keep looking for another one. if you can find a 5 speed car you'll have more fun with it. a bit more power with an extra gear!
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ive saved alot of 924's
current:
79 MochaSchwartz 931
83 944
87 924S
Instagram @anthoni.jpeg
formerly known as turbellion, lost password.

[slowcarfast]

An MGB GT is certainly on my short list for my next "fun" car.

Another really good place to look for these is the PCA classifieds. Yes, you have to pay to join the club to see the classifieds, but I'm pretty sure they offer a discounted membership for people who don't actually own a P-car (yet). And it's not expensive. In the past I've seen 4 to 6 924s on there at once, but right now there is only one: an '87 924S with 138K mi for $10K in New Jersey. I totally get wanting to buy what's available locally, even if it means you don't get the best car for the best money. There are real costs associated with NOT buying locally which have to factored in.

As to this car, I think you mentioned already some possibly bodged wiring. I'd say you should fully expect to spend some time sorting out the poorly executed wiring "fixes" of previous owners. I find the electrical stuff the easiest to do. Just need a proper wiring diagram, a mutimeter, and lots of patience. I too see a couple of disconnected hoses. One though is just the alternator cooling duct, so that's probably not a big deal. IDK what the green line is coming from the canister in front of the battery tray. Mine doesn't have that.

Have fun looking at the car! Let us know what happens!
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1981 924 Weissach Ed #187
1971 MG Midget

[D Hook]

For what you're spending to buy the car, plus the amount you'll have to put into it you could probably find a well sorted 944, post 1986.

The green hose running under the hood that attaches to part of the emissions system is cut. Replacing the hose isn't the problem. It's the "why was it cut in the first place" question that is the unkown. There's bunch of stuff under the dash that looks out of place. Pulling the dash is no problem, it's trying to figure out what the PO did under there and how butchered up the electricals are, not to mention the hvac. I understand you want to learn how to repair cars and all that but at the end of the day, our dream is always the day we get to start it and drive it and have it reliable enough. But the goal has to be reasonably achievable, both talent-wise and money-wise.

And here's my life lesson for ya'. Sleep on it. Think long and hard and search out other 924's, 931's or even 944's that you could put that much money into and have a very nice experience getting it sorted out and keeping it maintained. These things are not cheap to repair when they're not maintained and the few pictures you posted indicate the car has not been well looked after. The non-galvanized body will REALLY bite you in the ass down the road. It's not worth what he's asking and even at $5k CAD it's too much money for what it is. Take someone with you who's not emotionally involved in the buying process to point out the potential problems and then go home and start pricing out parts and parts availability. You'll be surprised how quickly it adds up. Then take that total and see what you can buy that is already in better condition, has the galvanized body and 5 lug, 4 disc brake setup and runs decent. Maybe just needs cosmetics, maybe paint, maybe a couple seat repairs.

And if you're already asking me how much it will be to fix the two little things I pointed out, you may want to re-examine your finances because the wonderful thing about working on these cars (and other hobby cars) is finding the right part, not the cheapest part.

Good luck.
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'80 924 n/a SOLD

[Rasta Monsta]

Don't be intimidated by the 2.5 platform. This lovely engine was designed by Porsche engineers from the ground up (not scavenged from the VW diesel parts bin), and eliminated many significant flaws in the 2,0. The 2.5 also suffers far less from "NLA syndrome" (having many critical parts that are no longer available).

Is a timing belt job on a 2.5 more expensive than on a 2.0? Yes. Harder? NO. While the "front of engine" package on the 2.5 is mechanically interesting, I wouldn't call it mechanically complex (i.e., it's just nuts and bolts...no dial indicators, camshaft jigs, etc).

Take it from someone with significant experience on both platforms. I sold my 2.0 turbo and will never touch another 2.0. The best evidence is found in these forums...people expend vast money and effort into trying to make the 2.0 more like...wait for it...the unmodified 2.5 (electronic engine management being a prime example).

My 2.5 turbo blows away my 931 in every way. Silky smooth (thanks to balance shafts) and reliable. Knock sensor, electronically controlled boost, water cooled turbo, intercooler. Even the heater works better! Oh, and an extra HUNDRED horsepower. Handy!

I appreciate the nostalgia of the old motors, but don't take 2.5 advice from anyone who has never laid a finger on one!




Rasta
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Toofah King Bad

• WeiBe (1987 924S 2.5t) - 931 S3

[D Hook]

Well said Rasta.

Dump this basket of problems, turn off the Porsche marque you have in your head and start researching other Porsche models. Do it intelligently rather than emotionally. And take a serious look at 944's. Much smoother, more refined than the 924. Don't get me wrong, I loved my 924. Until I drove a friends 944. Just as easy to work on as the 924's, IMHO. I would still have mine but got too old to be climbing under that G.D dash to futz with electrical problems. At least the 85-1/2 944's have the fuses under the hood instead. When I buy another Porsche, that will be a big consideration. Unless I win the lottery....then I'll just take it to the dealer and let them fix it while I sit in the lobby sipping a latte. And when it's finished, I'll drive it home to the garage, find a little grease to smear on my cheek and walk into the house and announce to my darling wife that I've fixed the car again and am tired, then lay down for a nap.

Wait, where was I again?
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'80 924 n/a SOLD

[gml]

anthonimartini, to me that sounds like an incredible deal. You probably know this but I'm sure you could do a lot better than that with another newbie, since the mindset I'm in is that the 924 is the last feasible foot in the door to Porsche ownership. I wonder what you all think, but from the mindset of a young dreamer I expect that prices will climb. Especially with what the local mechanics I chatted with told me about how COVID is affecting classic car demand. Its definitely brought me into the market.

slowcarfast, thanks for the advice. Been looking at PCA membership but honestly a little intimidated, but my experience on this forum is that the community is quite open and friendly so I'll probably go for it. Thanks for your thoughts on the pictures, I'll try to see how seller explains those concerns. I will absolutely keep you all posted!

D Hook, thanks for the honest advice. I have my finances in order and very well expecting to reinvest basically what I paid for this car on a yearly basis. I am just getting a sense of whether the problems you point out are a straight up dealbreaker, mostly since my goal is to get the car on the road this summer. In terms of your life advice, I've basically been unable to think about anything else since I've seen the listing. To your second post, I think that's all the more reason to just say no and come back later with a clearer head. I am fully convinced its way overpriced, I totally agree with you about the galvanized body, and you've convinced me the lack of maintenance and question marks are a short-term concern even if it apparently runs well. Appreciate the feedback!

Rasta, those are some great points. I am drawn to the early models for their conceptual simplicity and I don't care too much about going fast, but maybe I'll completely change my mind after I give this one a test drive. I'll broaden my horizons and look at 2.5s as well. Parts availability is a big concern for me as a newbie so thanks for the tips.

924board, I'm blown away at the incredible feedback I've received here. Can't thank you all enough! I hope that soon I'll be posting pics of my own water-cooled Porsche (preferably here, but the 944 forum if it shakes out that way!)

[Rasta Monsta]

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1987-porsche-924s-43/
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Toofah King Bad

• WeiBe (1987 924S 2.5t) - 931 S3

[Cedric]

Ive never worked on or driven US spec cars, so i can only base my opinions on the ones we have here, but i prefer the iron block engine. simpler (at least the ones we have), sounds better, less inherent flaws, and cheap parts, though some are NLA, most stuff is possible to find. I also lile the early cars due to the lack of everything, raw and simple. But of course as a daily driver a 944s2 for example is a great car, but i don't daily drive my toy cars

As you see, we all like different stuff and value different things. So best would be to have a look at different cars and see what you appreciate.
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1980 924 Turbo
www.instagram.com/garagecedric/

[Rasta Monsta]

[Fasteddie313]

I’ve looked at a bunch of 2.5s for sale.. 8 valve NAs through turbos and 4 valvers..
Never pulled the trigger..

I DO like the 44/51 chassis a LOT though..
I’m pretty sure, that for me personally, a V8 swap project 951 (944 turbo) is where I’d want to go..

I think close to 300 crank HP is relatively easy on a 2.0 Turbo on its original CIS.. Probably less cost than getting 400 out of a 2.5 turbo but about as easy..
Anything above that is going to get VERY expensive in a 2.5 because the block isn’t right for it, where a 2.0 runs out of fuel and needs a fueling upgrade..

I would stay away for non-turbo cars if you think you might want power later.. What it costs to get power in a NA car isn’t worth it..

If you don’t care about power, any 924 will do, and in that case you might want to stay away from a 2.0 turbo...

Basically the turbo cars, if they don’t run right, they will blow engines.. Non-Turbo cars will just run like crap, but not blow up..
The 2.0 turbo has a bit of a bad rep, because if it goes out of tune it’ll blow, but if it’s tuned well it’ll handle a LOT..


I would like an NA 2.0 car, but a later one, or a body clean earlier one..


New guy..
I really hate to tell you not to buy the car, because I really think we can use all the enthusiasts we can get around here, but that’s like a $1000-$1500 usd car to me..

We have been talking about prices goin up the entire time I’ve been here.. Not much has changed..

Almost all of us are pretty friendly around here, and a few of us get pretty wild with modifications..
We have a guy here machining his own turbocharger and aluminum parts, I’m the mad scientist type, others are restoring/upgrading very nice clean and/or original examples, Rasta just put a 951 engine in his 924 after having bad luck with a 2.0 turbo, but he tried really hard..

Their is an incredible amount of talent and information here, and I surely hope you get a 924 and stick around no matter what you choose..
I’d say we are very welcoming..