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931 (Woody) project
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Carrera RSR  



Joined: 08 Jan 2010
Posts: 2194
Location: Somerset, UK

PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You will have differing holes in the door for those two mirror versions.......some will need to be welded up + paint, some new to be drilled in. The old holes will not be covered by the early mirror

If you went for the non electric manual adj mirrors they bolt right up to existing holes......no messing about and weigh next to nothing compared to electric.
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1980 931 - forged pistons, Piper cam, K27/26 3257 6.10 hybrid turbo, 951 FMIC, custom intake, Mittelmotor dizzy & cam pulley, H&S exhaust, GAZ Gold, Fuch'ed, Quaife
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jacobroufa  



Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 332
Location: Rockford, IL

PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carrera RSR wrote:
You will have differing holes in the door for those two mirror versions.......some will need to be welded up + paint, some new to be drilled in. The old holes will not be covered by the early mirror

If you went for the non electric manual adj mirrors they bolt right up to existing holes......no messing about and weigh next to nothing compared to electric.


Yep, I tried looking for any set and these early mirrors happened to come up for me before the later style manual mirrors did. I would be curious what the weight difference is per mirror of the later style manual vs early style manual. I think there is a guy making reproductions of this later style (as well as other body parts) though I did not find out about this until after getting this pair.

Thankfully the service manual shows the correct measurements to place the old style mirror. Now to learn how to weld...
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jacobroufa  



Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 332
Location: Rockford, IL

PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://www.facebook.com/porsche.944.924.951

This is the guy making reproduction parts (including the mirrors) in the EU somewhere. He wants $300/set shipped.
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jacobroufa  



Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 332
Location: Rockford, IL

PostPosted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welp, I can't shift into 2nd gear now for some reason, like it won't let me push the shifter all the way forward as I need to.. This just happened on a drive with my daughter -- quite unsettling coming out of a corner. I've got all the other gears. Just 2nd won't engage, even with the car stationary. I pulled up the boot around the shifter and nothing's blocking it. Until the middle of the drive today it was going fine...
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15511
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's a rebuilt trans, so shouldn't be internal. My first concern is that the u-joint coupler to the gear selector input shaft has shifted or come loose.
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jacobroufa  



Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 332
Location: Rockford, IL

PostPosted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan, I was thinking the same thing. I remembered you telling me that (and being super grateful) when I got the thing, thinking one less thing to worry about! Still no grinding or anything strange, just no 2nd gear to be had..

So to do this, I have to drop the transmission yeah?
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jacobroufa  



Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 332
Location: Rockford, IL

PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2020 12:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow it's been MONTHS... I really want to drive this car

Finally got to the transmission this weekend. Linkage was all good, the bolt on the u-joint coupler was just fine as was the coupler itself. After getting the transmission out of the way, I could see the cup-end on the fixed linkage point was also in good shape.

So that was a pain in the butt, but not the worst job I've ever done. Those top two bolts, especially the driver's side with the u-joint in the way, were the worst part of it. If I had a lift it would have been a bit simpler. Having a transmission floor jack with a strap helped a TON.

While it's out I've got new boots and bolts for the axles. Anything else I should refurb while I'm in there? Part of me is saying "just drop the torsion tube and refresh those bushes".. with the gearbox out that's probably the time to do it, huh.. while I'm in there maybe reindex the bars and drop an inch or so. I am also planning on this being the race car, so I'm tempted by stiffer bars, and also to zip off the rear center tunnel for easier linkage and transmission work next time. I've got some thinking, and research, to do.

And now with the transmission out, I think I'm just going to drain it and crack the case and see what I can see. It's not shifting into 2nd and so I'm expecting to see some obstruction or something misaligned inside the box. If that is not the case, I'll probably have a professional look at it; this is the first time I've ever done anything with a gearbox, and of all the automotive things it's the most foreign to me. I have a manual and there are a couple good posts on the board, so we will see where I end up once the front of the case is off.
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Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1101
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 4:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its likely just the same issue as in all G31's... dreaded synchro


http://m-elliott.us/Porsche/G31Rebuild.htm

I did it once a loooong time ago before digital cameras and have yet to find any pictures

Edit: But...it was rebuilt so lets hope its something else. When I rebuilt mine I still had issues shifting afterward which was depressing. I ended up being really good at double clutching
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1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car
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jacobroufa  



Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 332
Location: Rockford, IL

PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2020 4:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I finally started tearing into the transmission this past weekend. First section has been disassembled; thankfully it is pretty simple to place the gear/washer/bearing assemblies oriented properly within that first housing set upright, and there are only four small parts aside from that which I've placed ordered in an egg carton. Second section will be more difficult and interesting; hopefully I'll be able to see exactly what it is that's blocking 2nd. I have had no more luck on the bench than in situ being able to shift into 2nd..

Mike, thanks so much for that link. Between that and the FSM I should be fine. It is less daunting once I've started to tear into it than it seemed originally just reading the procedure. Hopefully it stays that way and the problem is obvious!

So far so good though! I'm taking some pictures for my reference, and consulting the rebuild guide and FSM. With any luck I'll have it back together and in the car by spring, so I can focus on the other things this car still needs..
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jacobroufa  



Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 332
Location: Rockford, IL

PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2021 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Got the middle of the case off without too much fuss. Everything in here looks pretty clean as well...




So in the instructions I'm following are from this link, shared in several places throughout the forum: http://m-elliott.us/Porsche/G31Rebuild.htm




Per these instructions it looks as though there should be barely any space between the thrust washer and the outer bearing, but it seems I'm showing more. Check out in this video: https://i.imgur.com/xQEiFDs.mp4

Still at this point I can only engage 3rd gear -- I cannot successfully engage the 2nd gear, though to the eye everything looks right. Is it the gear itself? The syncro ring? What the heck is going on here?

In the teardown instructions it says the FSM calls for an hydraulic press. I have one, but should I be concerned about the alignment issues? Should I pull the whole assembly off?

I'm out of my depth here, by a long shot. Anyone w/ G31 rebuild experience can lend an eye?
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Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1101
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is definitely more than 0.012 inches

Can you make half moon temporary shims to close that gap and try to shift?
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1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car
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jacobroufa  



Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 332
Location: Rockford, IL

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 6:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Will try that. I am pretty slim on materials here to try that but I'll see what I can come up with.

Should I use an adhesive on that outer bearing to install it more securely? I'm guessing there was too much play on initial reinstallation (whenever it had its syncros replaced last) and because 2nd floats on the shaft, after many consecutive shifts just worked its way off slightly.. if I set it back to the correct tolerance w/ loctite that should prevent it from happening again right?
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Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1101
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 1:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does it rock a lot? Or is it just a snug slip fit that happens to move when you try?

Edit: I would approach this by pushing the roller bearing back toward 2nd gear to the aprox gap 0.012" and see if you can now shift it manually into 2nd gear
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1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car
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Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1101
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 3:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I read thru the elliot link since its been so long since I rebuilt mine. In the end it looks like you will have to carefully pull that bearing, check the trust washer for flatness (since you pull using it), clean everything with brake cleaner or other, use loctite 609 sparingly on the shaft (a light thin film...), and re-install properly gapped. Hopefully the shaft underneath the roller isn't worn. I am hoping its still a snug slip fit so the bearing remains straight on the shaft and not cocked in any way.
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1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car
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jacobroufa  



Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 332
Location: Rockford, IL

PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 5:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It does not rock, just slides back and forth, not super snug.

Mike if I'm understanding you I should push the bearing on until the gap is within the expected tolerance to test, and then pull it and reinstall with loctite?

Otherwise I think the assumption is that it'll just work its way back off again eventually..

Could this really have been the whole problem????

---

Ok so if that's it, for reassembling and resealing the case I will need some stuff.

Listed in another thread based on the m-elliot instructions:
Quote:

Transmission fill plug 111.301.127E Dealership $4.00
Gasket, transmission to differential housing 477.301.191.A Dealership $3.00
Input drive shaft seal 999.113.247.40 NAPA #NOS9706 $8.00
...
Shift-shaft seal 001.301.227 EuroWebParts.com # J1162-52304 $2.00


So my fill plug is in good shape -- I'll grab one just as a spare I think though. The "gasket, transmission to differential housing" -- is this between the middle and rear section of case? Not sure of the terminology because the diff is contained in the transmission.. I can't seem to find a picture though to confirm. Input drive shaft, and shift shaft seals, they are in good shape but I'll pick these up as well.

I read in another thread that Curil K2 is what I want for resealing the case. The front part did not have a gasket, just sealant. For the middle part do I want to use a thin layer of sealant on both sides of the gasket additionally?

For fluid, I have seen Redline recommended.. This 75W90 NS GL5 should be the right one, yeah?
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