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931 Tech To do list
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Cédric  



Joined: 27 Aug 2004
Posts: 1930
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If i remember correctly the Bosch 3 is std by the manual, should be around 8 in NGK numbers. I run b8egv myself.
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Carrera RSR  



Joined: 08 Jan 2010
Posts: 1903
Location: Somerset, UK

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MOTANUL wrote:
I can not find the bushing at the end of the stabilizer bar. (23 mm antiroll bar)

Even worse: on one side I have a dimension and on the other side I have another dimension.

23mm / 30 mm - 23 mm / 35 mm.

At first sight the little one is better. It came out very hard just hammered.
the large one came out very easy. The code written on it is for 24 mm (944).
Original spare part push rod 23 mm / 477411057K it's expensive because it inclued the metal part.

Does anyone know a code just for the bush? 23mm / 30 mm or 35 mm?

If I had to choose I would put both 30 mm. But I do not know which is the original side.





IIRC its 23 x 35 stock. But it doesn't really matter. Get a pair of whatever you can get as they are NLA new.
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1980 931 - forged pistons, Piper cam, K27/26 3257 6.10 hybrid turbo, 951 FMIC, custom intake, Mittelmotor dizzy & cam pulley, H&S exhaust, GAZ Gold, Fuch'ed, Quaife
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Carrera RSR  



Joined: 08 Jan 2010
Posts: 1903
Location: Somerset, UK

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MOTANUL wrote:
If no one knows, we're going to the next ones.

I decided to cut spark plug wires (ignition lead) to size. Even the original size are longer than it should be.

1. There is another hose (vacuum with red in pictures) that I think is too long.
You can confirm that it is too long?
I want to shorten it - not to hang on the engine.

2. Last question: spark plugs. On the car I found Bosch W3DPO. I was told that the spark plugs are too cold.
recommended are BOSCH WR7DS (for max 0,7 boost)
https://www.sparkplug-crossreference.com/convert/BOSCH_PN/WR7DS

I want to buy NGK iridium bpr6eix - crossreference with Bosch.



Bosch 3 is recommended in the UK manual. Some manuals/ suppliers list 4, others 5!! 924 NA is 7 which is too hot for our boosted motor

Plugs are only too cold if they are fouling and not running well. Check what yours look like and use the right one for your engine.

Cedric has been using NGK 8 for a long time. I used to. Now I'm using 10 for my higher boost motor without issue

http://www.924board.org/viewtopic.php?t=33439&sid=a7ae8ca15222a3462df36


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MOTANUL  



Joined: 19 Nov 2018
Posts: 113
Location: ROMANIA BUCHAREST

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carrera RSR wrote:


IIRC its 23 x 35 stock. But it doesn't really matter. Get a pair of whatever you can get as they are NLA new.


Easy to say hard to find them.
On Monday I expect a response from someone who promised to try to find something.
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MOTANUL  



Joined: 19 Nov 2018
Posts: 113
Location: ROMANIA BUCHAREST

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carrera RSR wrote:


Bosch 3 is recommended in the UK manual. Some manuals/ suppliers list 4, others 5!! 924 NA is 7 which is too hot for our boosted motor

Plugs are only too cold if they are fouling and not running well. Check what yours look like and use the right one for your engine.

Cedric has been using NGK 8 for a long time. I used to. Now I'm using 10 for my higher boost motor without issue



We both are right. I rechecked and for turbo UK Bosch W3DP - All models except UK Bosch WR7DS. Is there a high difference in turbo boost?

My car is german (non- UK car). so Bosch WR7DS
Bosh 7 means NGK 6.



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Cédric  



Joined: 27 Aug 2004
Posts: 1930
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would be careful, in the last service information folder from 82 they specify plug per region. Its clear that the full hp engine has the 3 and the low power engine has the 6. These engines run hot and are fairly close to knock in std form, i would rather start out with a plug to cold than the opposite.
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Carrera RSR  



Joined: 08 Jan 2010
Posts: 1903
Location: Somerset, UK

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cédric wrote:
I would be careful, in the last service information folder from 82 they specify plug per region. Its clear that the full hp engine has the 3 and the low power engine has the 6. These engines run hot and are fairly close to knock in std form, i would rather start out with a plug to cold than the opposite.


+1

The US market specs confuse us in EU. I’d go colder than hotter. Worse case scenario if too cold, the plugs foul up and motor runs rough. Worse case scenario if running to hot, detonation and you hole a piston or blow the head gasket.
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MOTANUL  



Joined: 19 Nov 2018
Posts: 113
Location: ROMANIA BUCHAREST

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found these spark plugs recommended for 924 Turbo 1980 in:
autoatlanta : Spark Plug - Genuine Porsche G99917017590 Known as: spark plug - Bosch - wr 6 ds
Haynes - From here I put the picture / Bosch - wr 6 ds
Porsche PARTS CATALOGUE - 999 170 165 90 (downloaded today from Porsche classic Genuine)
Porsche 924 Turbo assembly and adjusting instructions - Bosch - wr 6 ds

I understand that cooler spark plugs are necessary if:
- higher turbo boost (more than std)
- non std engine
- race track

In Haynes 924 NA has Bosch W5D /TURBO BOSCH WR7DS (non UK) / Turbo UK - W3DP

I have to admit that the values from Haynes seem a bit illogical.
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Carrera RSR  



Joined: 08 Jan 2010
Posts: 1903
Location: Somerset, UK

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stay with Bosch 3 or 4 or NGK 8 would be my recommendation. I ran these on stock and increased boost without issue.
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morghen  



Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 8126
Location: Romania

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carrera RSR wrote:
Stay with Bosch 3 or 4 or NGK 8 would be my recommendation. I ran these on stock and increased boost without issue.


Very good advice, especially if you will drive the car hard in the summer.
I ran Bosch 2 on my red car, worked perfectly and reduced detonation.
Don't always take the factory spec as the best. Often that is a cost compromise that they made or technology simply evolved over the last 40 years.
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Cédric  



Joined: 27 Aug 2004
Posts: 1930
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the factory must have confused themself with the documentation, and not separating the US from ROW version in some places. Hence the 1982 service information document have spark plug clearly specified per engine model. M31.03 M31.04 etc.
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MOTANUL  



Joined: 19 Nov 2018
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Location: ROMANIA BUCHAREST

PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2019 2:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aside from the obvious differences: "931" (left hand drive) for europe and "932" (right hand drive) for uk - Is the engine technically different?

I know the American engine has a few differences due to stringent emissions controls. (less power, nearly twenty percent down on the European model).

My question is whether the engine differs between UK model and Europe model.
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Carrera RSR  



Joined: 08 Jan 2010
Posts: 1903
Location: Somerset, UK

PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2019 4:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

They are ALL 931 model code. Only RHD specific parts had 932 part numbers..........

USA models had 140bhp due to many Federal restrictions which Euro cars have applied in the name of 'emissions/smog' protection. The only thing being protected by this ridiculous process the the USA car makers. Try telling me all USA V8's emit less emissions than a Euro car!!! Rant over

As for RoW cars regardless of Country of destination ended up with full fat power and had no fundamental differences in specification or output other than adjustments for LHD v RHD....... for example the exhaust manifold which had to clear the RHD steering column and similar. So most parts are interchangeable.
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MOTANUL  



Joined: 19 Nov 2018
Posts: 113
Location: ROMANIA BUCHAREST

PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2019 7:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In this case (the engine is the same, the ignition is identical) I do not understand why spark plugs are so different for uk / europa.
They should be identical as well.

The problem is that it is not wrong in one place: it is wrong in a lot of documentation (Porsche_924_Workshopmanual, 924-Turbo-Workshop-Manual, HAYNES 924 turbo, autoatlanta).

I found only 2 places where is different (exactly what you said from the beginning):
- E_924_79_KATALOG
OE PORSCHE: 999 170 140 90 TURBO BOSCH W4CS
- https://www.vwheritage.com/porsche/w3dpo-spark-plug-w3dpo-porsche-spare Bosch spark plug W3DPO / 924 Turbo 2.0 1980-1984

The most credible, updated information is here (Porsche classic -
Porsche Classic Genuine Parts Catalogue 2017: 924, 1980 - 1985)

Now it's pretty clear to me that spark plugs are good - what else could explain a very high gasoline consumption (over 20 l per 100 km)


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Carrera RSR  



Joined: 08 Jan 2010
Posts: 1903
Location: Somerset, UK

PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2019 10:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MOTANUL wrote:

The problem is that it is not wrong in one place: it is wrong in a lot of documentation (Porsche_924_Workshopmanual, 924-Turbo-Workshop-Manual, HAYNES 924 turbo, autoatlanta).


Some English Porsche documentation, Haynes and AutoAtlanta will most likely be USA spec, not RoW.

Bosch 3 or 4 won't make a huge amount of difference in the running of the engine nor in plug running condition.
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1980 931 - forged pistons, Piper cam, K27/26 3257 6.10 hybrid turbo, 951 FMIC, custom intake, Mittelmotor dizzy & cam pulley, H&S exhaust, GAZ Gold, Fuch'ed, Quaife
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