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Pray for the '82 931...
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morghen  



Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 7674
Location: Romania

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 3:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hold on, except the boost, there is no difference between the euro S1 and the US S1, is there?
Just turn up that boost to 0.7 man...you don't need to invest in anything else to have yourself a quick 924.
Just make sure you've got fuel to cover that boost and you're ready to go...no need for modern engine management witchcraft unless you want to get more than 200hp out of the S1.
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924RACR  



Joined: 29 Jul 2001
Posts: 8036
Location: Royal Oak, MI, USA

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 4:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mine's an S2... and I'll leave it to Dan to answer the detailed tech questions like that! LOL

But yeah, at least I now have the right gauges to tell me if everything's happy... so game on!

Just need to wait for the snow to leave again, for good... and then find room for a few more hoses through the firewall!!
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'79 924 #77 ITB racecar
'82 931 Plat. Silver
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Rasta Monsta  



Joined: 12 Jul 2006
Posts: 11332
Location: PacNW

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 5:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

morghen wrote:
Hold on, except the boost, there is no difference between the euro S1 and the US S1, is there.


Euro lacks the frequency valve, and therefore the WOT enrichment circuit, no?
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morghen  



Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 7674
Location: Romania

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 6:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't know for sure but nothing stopping you from upping the boost while still staying safe if you use high octane fuel. Must not be race fuel but I've tested that on my GTS wannabe and it makes a difference even from high octane pump fuel.
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15462
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 2:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DITC is different on Euro S2, so presumably a different ignition map.

Bumping a US S2 from 7psi to 10psi should be relatively safe as long as you're not stupid, and take care on the hottest summer days.
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15 981 GTS | 88 924S SE | 82 931 Holbert | 82 931 Rallye | 81 937 | 81 Euro 931 | 81 Weissach | 80 US 928 | 80 US 931 '941' | 80 US 931 | 80 931 GTR | 79 Sebring | 78 D-Prod Replica | 78 w/D-Prod kit | 78 Poli-Form | 78 Limited Edition | 77 Martini
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924RACR  



Joined: 29 Jul 2001
Posts: 8036
Location: Royal Oak, MI, USA

PostPosted: Thu Mar 30, 2017 10:57 pm    Post subject: March update Reply with quote

Time for a little update... drove 'er to work last three days, thanks to the salt finally clearing away. Lots of fun! Until I got stuck at the gas pump refueling on the way to work. Typical hot-start starter-based issue.

Will be redoing the wiring to the starter, plus the battery ground (replaced them some time ago, but will be doing a better job this time) and a new gear reduction starter from Ideola. Enough of this stupidity.

I also noticed that my clutch master cylinder is dripping at the boot, so will swap that out too before it becomes a problem.

Then maybe soon I can get to installing the boost controller and really having some fun! Mixture/AFR and general running have been going quite well... though she is consuming a fair bit of oil at the moment; will probably switch back from Mobil1 to dyno oil for the summer, beat on her hard, try and get those rings to seat in better...
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'79 924 #77 ITB racecar
'82 931 Plat. Silver
#25 Hidari Firefly P2 sports prototype
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15462
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

924RACR wrote:
Rasta Monsta wrote:
924RACR wrote:
I had previously removed the electronic component. . .to clean off corrosion.


What did you find in there? Is this good maintenance? Are there alternative plug and play solutions for this part?


I seem to recall some corrosion (was at least at the beginning of this year, if not earlier).

No, apparently this was not good maintenance! Maybe if I'd used some proper conductive paste (like from Radio Shack or other electronics supply place).

I'm tempted to re-paste it and reinstall, see if the problem returns. Glad to hear that it's a common part...

According to the photo of the one I took off, I see part # 211 905 351, mfgr is Fairchild, and it's clearly marked VW/Audi.

Edit: exactly this part:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/151747513189?lpid=82&chn=ps&ul_noapp=true

$30 on eBay, apparently there are new ones too. Hell, that one above is around the corner from me! LOL

Yeah, Walmart sells a new one!
https://www.walmart.com/ip/NEW-IGNITION-CONTROL-MODULE-FITS-EUROPEAN-MODEL-1979-1989-VOLKSWAGEN-211-905-351A-B-D-0-227-100-116-0-227-100-118-0-227-100-137/113340650?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=1134&adid=22222222227050039562&wmlspartner=wmtlabs&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=c&wl3=145320267749&wl4=pla-261006180645&wl5=9016902&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=112343853&wl11=online&wl12=113340650&wl13=&veh=sem

One more, original part # (per the PET parts catalog) is 191 905 351 A... Google search shows it turning up as a VW Golf Mk1/Mk2 ignition control module...

PS - thanks to John Brown for providing the part!


A couple of additional part numbers for the ignition module that come up in a cross reference search:
211 905 351
0 227 100 137 (Bosch)
93 90 220 (Beru)

Audi - Volkswagen OE #: 211 905 351 D
Saab OE #: 9390220
Volvo OE #: 1389939

Alternate, update or replacement for Bosch #'s:
0227100142, 0227100139, 0227100113, 0227100116

Alternate, update or replacement for Audi - VW #'s:
191905351B, 211905351B, 211905351E

Alternate, update or replacement for Volvo #s:
285230

191 905 351B => this one includes the heat sink.
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924RACR  



Joined: 29 Jul 2001
Posts: 8036
Location: Royal Oak, MI, USA

PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:33 pm    Post subject: Time for modern electronics? Reply with quote

Ugh. About ready to give up on this damn thing and take the plunge to Megasquirt.

Still have a few more things to check, but the lack of consistent starting is killing me, keeping me from being able to drive this poor car that desperately needs miles.

It's now at the point where it won't start except with full throttle... and when hot will only start with starting fluid. Need to check the fuel pressures when this is happening... but it's really behaving nothing like it did before I tore it all apart for the rebuild.

Ignition, I'm fairly confident is OK; spark may be a bit suspect when cranking, but that'd be a simple matter of power distribution, and could readily be resolved by installing a starter relay as I have on the 924 racecar - so may try that soon.

I also have a data acq system I can borrow from my other (prototype) racecar (actually already removed, for the winter) and use to log data on voltages at various spots while cranking (like ignition power, fuel pump power etc).

Already have the fuel rail for the conversion, and the injector cups... lessee, what else... crank sensor and trigger wheel, injectors and pressure regulator... whatever other sensors, I think MAP and IAT right? Then just an ECU, I think...

So annoying...
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'79 924 #77 ITB racecar
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morghen  



Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 7674
Location: Romania

PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're overthinking it and about to overdo it.
If it runs well once it starts then the spark is just fine.
Your problem is surely with the fuel pressures, AFR mixture and who knows, maybe vacuum leaks as well.

Do a pressures test cold and hot. install a wideband afr sensor and gauge.
My red car has hot start problems as well, it will start with some cranking but it will start quickly with WOT applied because the fuel vapours go out the injectors immediately when the intake lifts the CIS plate.
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924RACR  



Joined: 29 Jul 2001
Posts: 8036
Location: Royal Oak, MI, USA

PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, you guessed correctly but I neglected to mention, it does run pretty good once started.

I do have a wideband O2 and gauge - but can't see anything meaningful when cranking of course.

Have been all over the map trying to find mixture settings to make it work normally again. I could totally see the WUR failing again, and will have to do some soul-searching to decide if I want to again get a rebuilt... though still admittedly cheaper than the EFI conversion...
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Vaughan Scott
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924RACR  



Joined: 29 Jul 2001
Posts: 8036
Location: Royal Oak, MI, USA

PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2017 12:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vac leaks is a problem too, thanks to one recalcitrant injector cup that is stripped out... have an old spare, plus new cups for EFI conversion; if time permits, I may see if I can cut the weak plastic bit off the brass center screw-in mount for the 931 injector, and epoxy it into the new/replacement cup to allow me to eliminate that leak...
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924RACR  



Joined: 29 Jul 2001
Posts: 8036
Location: Royal Oak, MI, USA

PostPosted: Sat Oct 21, 2017 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

morghen wrote:
You're overthinking it and about to overdo it.
If it runs well once it starts then the spark is just fine.
Your problem is surely with the fuel pressures, AFR mixture and who knows, maybe vacuum leaks as well.

Do a pressures test cold and hot.


So yeah...

System pressure was barely over 5.0 bar... managed with much work to get it up to 5.5, still weak (with every shim I had around). Suspicious of poor power supply to the fuel pump - have to dive into that tomorrow (did already check the ground).

Control pressure is WAY low - around 1.0-1.5 bar, not even quite getting to 2.0 (cold/20C ambient, no power/heat to the WUR). So pulled that out, and will be seeing about tweaking it to get that back up (as well as cleaning)... fingers crossed...
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Vaughan Scott
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'79 924 #77 ITB racecar
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#25 Hidari Firefly P2 sports prototype
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924RACR  



Joined: 29 Jul 2001
Posts: 8036
Location: Royal Oak, MI, USA

PostPosted: Sat Oct 21, 2017 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Added detail on the pump power supply; plugging in the frequency valve cost me 0.1 bar alone, when I was sitting there with the relay jumpered...

Gonna take a few minutes and trace the voltage supply level through the wiring loom...
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