View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
anthonimartini
Joined: 17 Feb 2020 Posts: 240 Location: portland oregon
|
Posted: Mon Dec 20, 2021 7:26 am Post subject: 2.0 ABA in a early car... |
|
|
so i just finished building a really nice aba for a customers 1980 caddie truck.
10.6 supertech pistons, big cam from techtonics, weber 40mm dcoe's. eagle h beam rods.
beautifully ported head from my friend dan steinhart.
pretty much put all the best street performance parts from techtonics.
this engine cost me like 3k to build and was extremely easy. priming the oil and starting it for the first time went flawlessly.
this engine is incredible.... revs like a crotchrocket, fast as hell, and extremely easy to tune. not to mention a very small engine package with carbs and no ac.
HOW THE HELL CAN I GET ONE IN MY 924...
I JUST SPENT LIKE 6K BUILDING A 931 D-PROD STYLE ENGINE AND IT BARELY FEELS FASTER THEN STOCK (ALTHOUGH BUILDS POWER ALL THE WAY TO REDLINE AT 7K and sounds incredible)
i am done with the early engines, the lack of parts, the annoying cams and lifters, the overall lack of power and smoothness.
seriously lets get some minds together and make a kit to install these old VW 8 valves. even in totally stock form a 2.0 aba will outmatch a 924 engine in every way including having hydraulic lifters and never needing real attention. parts for the ABA are cheap and very high quality. with efi we could expect 30mpg or more with our low 5th gear and drag coefficient.
ive got a block,flywheels and both a 944,931 and N/A 924 bellhousings.... _________________ ive saved alot of 924's
current:
79 MochaSchwartz 931
83 944
87 924S
Instagram @anthoni.jpeg
formerly known as turbellion, lost password. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Cedric
Joined: 27 Aug 2004 Posts: 2608 Location: Sweden
|
Posted: Mon Dec 20, 2021 7:40 am Post subject: |
|
|
If you put 7k into an engine and it barely feels faster I think you must have made some strange choices.
For all the energy and money a serious engine swap takes i would put something in there that's actually different than the standard engine. But it's not my car _________________ 1980 924 Turbo
www.instagram.com/garagecedric/ |
|
Back to top |
|
|
anthonimartini
Joined: 17 Feb 2020 Posts: 240 Location: portland oregon
|
Posted: Mon Dec 20, 2021 8:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
cedric- well it i spent much of that money converting my NA into a essentially a 931 equipped car.
i have not calculated the cost exactly of the engine but i had the head professionally ported and rebuilt with stainless valves at the same time, had to modify my rods to suit 22mm pins, everything lightened and dynamically balanced. 1500 aluminum 911 clutch, msds header, totally rebuilt k-jet. everything just added up quickly. i think the problem is i should just pop a turbo on it.
as for my preference of the aba engine, i drive my car everyday. i will drive my car across the USA (about 3k miles). i dont like to be stranded and i dont like roadside repairs. i care less about the car having 250HP then i do about it being reliable and getting good gas mileage. surely i could just get a modern car but as you said before i make strange choices, not disputing that. the thing i like about the ABA is it checks all of the desired boxes for me and is a engine i can literally pick up and set on the bench. it is tiny, and very lightweight. i would love to have that lightweight package in my car, knowing i can buy parts when i need, knowing i dont have to deal with the shitty cam and lifters, wornout heads,blocks and unnatainable pistons. having just built this 150hp ABA for peanuts i am smitten by them. however i have no desire to drive a front wheel drive car...
also being in the USA i live in a different world of 924 then you do. our bog standard 924 is 95hp... and thats the most common one available. they suck, they all have worn cams and lifters. rusty bores and because nobody ever fixed them when the k-jet acted up so they sat for 20-30 years. your baseline was 125HP. i am just tired of dealing with the 2.0 hell i might just throw a m44 in it. _________________ ive saved alot of 924's
current:
79 MochaSchwartz 931
83 944
87 924S
Instagram @anthoni.jpeg
formerly known as turbellion, lost password. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Juho
Joined: 03 Oct 2018 Posts: 377 Location: Finland
|
Posted: Mon Dec 20, 2021 10:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
if u wanted more power why go with so mild compression and jetronic? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
anthonimartini
Joined: 17 Feb 2020 Posts: 240 Location: portland oregon
|
Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2021 1:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
I ended up with the compression I have because that’s what the parts I used gave me. Right about 9.3:1 so not really that low especially considering our us spec engines are 8.3:1 or 8.5:1. Kjet can make plenty of power when tuned properly, I am waiting for my wideband to come in the mail so I can make sure I have it tuned perfectly. I feel like I have it tuned too rich. I want to get the car on the dyno soon because i may just have a engine that has plenty of power but very little low end. The car feels great in the upper range and on the Highway. I’m using a 944 gearbox and it will push 110 in that tall 5th gear which was similar to my 944. I feel like it is inevitable that I will put my turbo setup on by the end of January. _________________ ive saved alot of 924's
current:
79 MochaSchwartz 931
83 944
87 924S
Instagram @anthoni.jpeg
formerly known as turbellion, lost password. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
morghen
Joined: 21 Jan 2005 Posts: 8879 Location: Romania
|
Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2021 8:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
Or buy a supercharger bolt on (ish) kit and make up for the low/mid range lack of the 2L NA. _________________ https://www.the924.com |
|
Back to top |
|
|
anthonimartini
Joined: 17 Feb 2020 Posts: 240 Location: portland oregon
|
Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2021 11:17 am Post subject: |
|
|
Morghen- I am thinking about it! I love that kit. _________________ ive saved alot of 924's
current:
79 MochaSchwartz 931
83 944
87 924S
Instagram @anthoni.jpeg
formerly known as turbellion, lost password. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
morghen
Joined: 21 Jan 2005 Posts: 8879 Location: Romania
|
Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2021 6:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I've just started a new list for early 2022 and hope to deliver these kits at the end of Feb. There are a few spots left.
The setup really wakes up the 2L at lower and mid rpm.
I just love getting out of turns quick or sometime sideways
https://youtu.be/5UiZwEk8Upg _________________ https://www.the924.com |
|
Back to top |
|
|
safe
Joined: 18 Mar 2017 Posts: 586 Location: Sweden
|
Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2021 8:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
anthonimartini wrote: | cedric- well it i spent much of that money converting my NA into a essentially a 931 equipped car.
i have not calculated the cost exactly of the engine but i had the head professionally ported and rebuilt with stainless valves at the same time, had to modify my rods to suit 22mm pins, everything lightened and dynamically balanced. 1500 aluminum 911 clutch, msds header, totally rebuilt k-jet. everything just added up quickly. i think the problem is i should just pop a turbo on it.
as for my preference of the aba engine, i drive my car everyday. i will drive my car across the USA (about 3k miles). i dont like to be stranded and i dont like roadside repairs. i care less about the car having 250HP then i do about it being reliable and getting good gas mileage. surely i could just get a modern car but as you said before i make strange choices, not disputing that. the thing i like about the ABA is it checks all of the desired boxes for me and is a engine i can literally pick up and set on the bench. it is tiny, and very lightweight. i would love to have that lightweight package in my car, knowing i can buy parts when i need, knowing i dont have to deal with the shitty cam and lifters, wornout heads,blocks and unnatainable pistons. having just built this 150hp ABA for peanuts i am smitten by them. however i have no desire to drive a front wheel drive car...
also being in the USA i live in a different world of 924 then you do. our bog standard 924 is 95hp... and thats the most common one available. they suck, they all have worn cams and lifters. rusty bores and because nobody ever fixed them when the k-jet acted up so they sat for 20-30 years. your baseline was 125HP. i am just tired of dealing with the 2.0 hell i might just throw a m44 in it. |
Good used parts for the 924 can be hard to find, but a set of used NA euro pistons and decking the block would have given you about the same experience for a lot less. Balancing and lighten parts makes it spin nice to.
Put back the NA head and enjoy the compression..... You might have to go with a slightly thicker head gasket.
Or as you say put a turbo on it and try to beat Dutchpug... _________________ /Magnus, Stockholm Sweden
=======================
Porsche 924 -79 NA, EFI and Turbo.
Porsche 931 -79
Porsche 911 -77, 3.2 Targa
Porsche 911 -69, 3.6, Coupe |
|
Back to top |
|
|
anthonimartini
Joined: 17 Feb 2020 Posts: 240 Location: portland oregon
|
Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2021 12:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
I initially was going to just build a euro na. I found pistons out of Germany waited nearly 3 months for them to arrive and then found all the ring lands were really loose… that’s when I decided to build this current engine. I still have the na head that I paid 700 bucks to get rebuilt and ported. _________________ ive saved alot of 924's
current:
79 MochaSchwartz 931
83 944
87 924S
Instagram @anthoni.jpeg
formerly known as turbellion, lost password. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
morghen
Joined: 21 Jan 2005 Posts: 8879 Location: Romania
|
Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2021 12:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
All NA ring lands are like that, they are like that since the 90s when they abused these cars and used crap oil, if any
Get thicker custom rings and get a move on.
Euro NA is nice but you'll outgrow it, especially in today's world where your modern daily diesel will run rings around your 924. _________________ https://www.the924.com |
|
Back to top |
|
|
safe
Joined: 18 Mar 2017 Posts: 586 Location: Sweden
|
Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2021 1:17 am Post subject: |
|
|
Yes, I looked at several set of NA pistons with really worn ring groves. But the pistons in my engine was pretty OK.
But you can get a set of rings made at reasonable prices and have the groves machined to fit.
I think its usually the top ring grove that is worn. Someone with talent could probably make rings from scratch on a lathe from cast iron stock.
I was about to do this when I found a set of forged aftermarket pistons at a very good price. _________________ /Magnus, Stockholm Sweden
=======================
Porsche 924 -79 NA, EFI and Turbo.
Porsche 931 -79
Porsche 911 -77, 3.2 Targa
Porsche 911 -69, 3.6, Coupe |
|
Back to top |
|
|
safe
Joined: 18 Mar 2017 Posts: 586 Location: Sweden
|
Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2021 1:42 am Post subject: |
|
|
To go back to the original question of the ABA engine.
The one thing I get hanged up about:
Since virtually no engines "bolt in" and would need some serious development, why go for a sour engine like that?
There is plenty of engines that offer better technology and more power for peanuts.
You would probably spend as much time and money to figure this out as with an LS1 or Honda K series. Those engines would be a little more money (maybe) but in stock form a lot more powerful and modified almost unlimited.
If you figure out a conversion with some street cred, it could probably monetised too. _________________ /Magnus, Stockholm Sweden
=======================
Porsche 924 -79 NA, EFI and Turbo.
Porsche 931 -79
Porsche 911 -77, 3.2 Targa
Porsche 911 -69, 3.6, Coupe |
|
Back to top |
|
|
anthonimartini
Joined: 17 Feb 2020 Posts: 240 Location: portland oregon
|
Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2021 7:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
I have had deves make rings before and it was pretty cheap. The machine work will likely be around 200. So around 300-400 total. Conversely I can hand my machinist a worn euro piston and have him make 4 custom forged pistons with modern rings and 88mmbore with 22mm pinsfor around 1000 bucks. I may actually just do this and slap my n/a head on. The larger bore will bring the euro compression closer to 9.5. I can use my fresh bottom end and machined block for this. I could probably get over 130hp out of that setup and it would be extremely reliable for a long time. More if I go to a more agressive cam with shimmed Alfa style lifters. _________________ ive saved alot of 924's
current:
79 MochaSchwartz 931
83 944
87 924S
Instagram @anthoni.jpeg
formerly known as turbellion, lost password. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
anthonimartini
Joined: 17 Feb 2020 Posts: 240 Location: portland oregon
|
Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2021 7:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
As for my desire to use a ABA I can’t really explain it but the engine i just built for my customer is frankly badass! I know his mk1 vw is lighter but that thing is seriously fast. I live about an hour away from techtonics tuning so I was able to go in and talk to the owner , he helped me select the parts for the build. Such a nice experience compared to my usual 924 builds. _________________ ive saved alot of 924's
current:
79 MochaSchwartz 931
83 944
87 924S
Instagram @anthoni.jpeg
formerly known as turbellion, lost password. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|