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AGD931
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
Posts: 289
Location: Athens, Greece
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 Posted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 10:20 pm Post subject: 944 S2 engine in 931 |
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As I have a nice little donor 944 S2, and a bare 931 shell (which will become a CGT replica), I have been thinking about dropping all the S2 running gear/electrics etc into the 931. I will keep the Euro dogleg gearbox on the 931 as I prefer the gate & it also has an LSD!
I have studied a bit into this, has anyone any ideas/thoughts on this conversion, if anybody has done something similar, even with a 944 2.5 engine, I would appreciate any feedback.
Thanks
Arthur
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1981 931 S2
1990 E30 320i Cabrio
1979 Ford Capri Ghia |
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ic932
Joined: 11 Feb 2005
Posts: 1104
Location: UK
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| Posted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 10:38 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Arthur, long time no see...
I have been playing around with different 931/944s2 projects for awhile now. I can confirm that an S2 engine/G31 transmission combo is very sweet indeed.
There's some good info regarding the chassis work needed to install the engine (I'm sure you have already studied it).
I say go for it...
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ideola
Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15550
Location: Spring Lake MI
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 12:36 am Post subject: |
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The biggest issue will be the engine mounting and cross member conversion. Not insurmountable at all if you have access to good fabrication equipment and skills.
You might need/want to remove the 2.0L engine mounting brackets in the rear corners of the engine bay, and then you will need to modify the frame spars to accept the aluminum cross member.
If you can find (or already have) a 924S/944 donor chassis, you might even consider splicing in the entire front frame spar section rather than trying to custom fabricate something. Should not be a difficult job for an experienced welder.
The next most difficult aspect of the conversion will be moving the electrics over to the 931 chassis. If the 931 is completely stripped, what I would do is move the entire complete-car harness from the 944 into the 931. Easy enough to do if the 931 is truly just a shell. A lot of work if you haven't already stripped out all of the interior. Again, nothing that is technically difficult, just tedious and time consuming.
RE: the suspension, I would just swap out the entire rear suspension assembly (after rebuilding the 944 stuff on the bench), as the alu trailing arms require different spring plates, and switching stuff around can be a PITA. If you can drop both torsion carrier assemblies, you can do a straight swap with the removal of 8 or 10 bolts. As for the front, if you swap the front frame spars as I described above, the added benefit is that you will carry over the 944 front sway bar mounting points, which you would otherwise have to duplicate if you keep the 931 front frame spars.
The rest should be pretty easy. With the G31 and a CGT body kit, it should turn out to be a pretty compelling ride!
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AGD931
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
Posts: 289
Location: Athens, Greece
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 1:04 am Post subject: |
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ic932 - yeah, unfortunately lots of private stuff got in the way the last couple of years, I think the 931 has done maybe 60 miles in that time 
I am due to start working on this project within the next week, so I will have lots of pics to post over the coming months.
ideola - thanks for your input and advice, something tells me you have done this before...  I suspected as much that the most difficult part would be the front crossmember 
Arthur
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1990 E30 320i Cabrio
1979 Ford Capri Ghia |
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ic932
Joined: 11 Feb 2005
Posts: 1104
Location: UK
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 1:06 am Post subject: |
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| ideola wrote: | | You might need/want to remove the 2.0L engine mounting brackets in the rear corners of the engine bay |
I would leave them in situ (I have them welded into my 944 should I wish to drop in a 931 motor at some point, they do not interfere with an S2 engine). Not only that, they provide a structual funtion also. The work needed to mount the alloy x-member is well upstream from the engine mounts and therefore they need not be touched.
Yes, if at some point you decided to upgrade your brakes then your best bet would be to drop the G31 specific rear beam and rebuild with the later springplates/alloy arms ect... But a brake upgrade is totally optional given the S2 power output IMO.
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ideola
Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15550
Location: Spring Lake MI
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 1:15 am Post subject: |
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| ic932 wrote: | | Yes, if at some point you decided to upgrade your brakes then your best bet would be to drop the G31 specific rear beam and rebuild with the later springplates/alloy arms ect... But a brake upgrade is totally optional given the S2 power output IMO. |
Fair enough re: the brakes, but it opens up the option of running 944/968-based rear suspension components...like COIL OVERS which are more difficult to adapt to the steel trailing arms...
Just something to consider...
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Carrera RSR
Joined: 08 Jan 2010
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Location: Somerset, UK
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 1:50 am Post subject: |
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Looking forward to reading this build.
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1980 931 - forged pistons, Piper cam, K27/26 3257 6.10 hybrid turbo, 951 FMIC, custom intake, Mittelmotor dizzy & cam pulley, H&S exhaust, GAZ Gold, Fuch'ed, Quaife
Now www.924board.org/viewtopic.php?t=34690
Then www.924board.org/viewtopic.php?t=31252 |
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ideola
Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15550
Location: Spring Lake MI
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 3:34 am Post subject: |
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| AGD931 wrote: | | something tells me you have done this before |
Nope, haven't done it, but I've read with great interest a few previous attempts...it also helps that I've stripped down a few of these cars and spent a lot of time contemplating what it would take to do such a swap. In many respects, I think it's a highly underrated possibility for people looking for a more powerful toofah. Much better than going V8 in my opinion. Keep it in the family, eh?!
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gohim
Joined: 02 Nov 2002
Posts: 4459
Location: Rialto, CA
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| Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 4:40 am Post subject: |
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It's been done before.
There was an article in Excellence about a car that had this done, probably over ten years ago. |
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sbarc
Joined: 01 Feb 2010
Posts: 545
Location: West Coast of Canada
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| Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:12 am Post subject: |
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Switching it to a 944 Turbo drivetain would be even sweeter. The 944 Turbo donor cars are starting to get pretty cheap.
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1981 931 (Canadian car)
1981 931 (US car)
1990 928GT (ROW car)
1991 Toyota MR2
1989 Toyota MR2 Super Charged
1985 Toyota Supra
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ic932
Joined: 11 Feb 2005
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Location: UK
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| Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 6:10 am Post subject: |
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| sbarc wrote: | | Switching it to a 944 Turbo drivetain would be even sweeter. The 944 Turbo donor cars are starting to get pretty cheap. |
Yeah but if your gonna go the Audi route then why not just stick with a S2 box? What advantages would you get with a Turbo box?
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Jakkq
Joined: 29 Sep 2008
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Location: Omaha, Nebraska
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AGD931
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
Posts: 289
Location: Athens, Greece
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| Posted: Wed Jun 15, 2011 11:45 pm Post subject: |
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Hi guys, I'm back...
first things first, my project 944S2 engine to 931 is temporarily on hold... but do not despair!!!!! At the Porsche Independent Centre where I am service manager we finished today after approx. 3 weeks from start to finish (and in between other workshop jobs) a 931 S1 (CGT look) rally car to which we fitted a 944 S2 engine. (previously 931 engine)
to cut a long story short ( as I will be posting pics up later today) the longest job was as Ideola said the crossmember and engine mounting, nothing difficult or demanding however.
this is just a "wet your appetite" post. Details on exactly what we did, what gearbox/torque tube etc etc I will give in a later post, as I am at work now...
Arthur
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AGD931
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
Posts: 289
Location: Athens, Greece
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| Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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Hi all,
sorry for not posting any pics, I have been in hospital for the last week after a a minor operation. All went well thank God, I am at home now recouperating. I have lots of oics on the iphone of the completed car, will get them up sometime today.
Arthur
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1981 931 S2
1990 E30 320i Cabrio
1979 Ford Capri Ghia |
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AGD931
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
Posts: 289
Location: Athens, Greece
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