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The 80 NA build log
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Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1102
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 2:28 am    Post subject: The 80 NA build log Reply with quote

Ok, I may not be the best on 24 trivia and such. I have been a bit slow in some threads too and vow that I will read more thoroughly before posting. I was also mean and for that I apologized (I understand its a web phenomenon that people react strangely on forums and there are examples here). I am a busy guy both with work and personal life. This is a good thing. I have also been busy with 924 stuff but never as busy as I wish due to the aforementioned 'busyness'. Alas, such is life

With that said, here is the 1980 924 continuing build. It is somewhat sad to say that this is the longest build ever but I want to share some of the newer improvements, testing, and progress.

The goal of the car is not a race car but a lighter weight sports car with much being made to increase overall mpg. I believe this comes from steps taken everywhere and not just in one grand item or another. The smaller steps add up to a greater whole. No step too small either. When no one does it for you you must take up the tools and apply knowledge to do it yourself. I must also add that this car is a fair weather car only but certainly no trailer queen in any way.

On a final note, I know there are steps taken here that have gone off the beaten path and may offend some Porsche aficionados.

In my sig I mention front end weight loss. I am optimistic since some numbers came from virtual calculations but they will be close and improvements to the original test items are already in the works.

So much for babbling and disclaimers...


Wilwood caliper adapters for '4-lug' spindles. Light and strong. Edit: I am working on a another adapter for other spindles this winter.
(The 6mm thread is now 8mm. Please ignore how small that looks)


Adapter mock up in plastic


Test mounted in aluminum

_________________
1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15511
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 3:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is awesome stuff, as are some of the other tidbits you've shown us. What is your capacity or interest in reproducing and reselling?
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75 Fiat X1/9 | 80 US 931 '941' | 78 Poli-Form
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Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1102
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 3:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ideola wrote:
This is awesome stuff, as are some of the other tidbits you've shown us. What is your capacity or interest in reproducing and reselling?


Edit: Thanks! BTW

I would like to test some of the stuff first but there is capacity and interest at some point to do just that. Of course if you have ideas that I could produce that would work too. I have been looking at all the GTP stuff when that thread was live and wondering what I could do?

This particular adapter is for a custom 4-lug hub and disc(s) so the spacing for a standard disc may be off. However all this is in CAD which is great for moving from one idea to the next.

Another pic...



Added: Caliper to disc alignment. Perfectly to center of disc afer all that work.


_________________
1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car
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Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1102
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 5:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Next... and here come the possible rub with some people

The wheel hub combo. I have always been disappointed with wheel choices for 924's especially those with four lug. So it was time to look elsewhere. That doesn't mean I don't like Porsche wheels I have some '44 S2 wheels on the 931 but I needed a real lightweight option.

A new test hub was designed in CAD and CNC machined in mdf (compressed cardboard for lack of a better description). This was matched to 16 x 6.5 super lightweight ROTA race wheels. The goal being choice, low cost, and lowering inertia of the entire wheel assembly. The lowering of inertia lowers the work done from stop light to stoplight and will work the brakes less. This next pic shows the mock up with wooden/cardboard hub. High strength drag racing studs with even lighter aluminum nuts are used. Can we guess the pattern?


_________________
1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car


Last edited by Mike9311 on Fri Aug 27, 2010 1:57 am; edited 2 times in total
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15511
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 5:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

4x100 or 4x108
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Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1102
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 5:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's it, 4x100 civic wheel pattern. Then the choices are huge.

The hub also accepts 4 different Wilwood discs. The one behind the wheel is the lightest. The sad part, about this pic, is that it was taken in '08. Edit: This was a recent pic the MDF mockup was in '08

Here is the aluminum hub with scalloped rotor. There are 3 other 'normal' rotor choices too that simply bolt right up to the new hub. The discs are 11.75in (298.5mm).

The studs are not pressed in obviously in this pic.


_________________
1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car


Last edited by Mike9311 on Sun Aug 22, 2010 5:01 am; edited 2 times in total
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flosho  



Joined: 01 Jul 2004
Posts: 3153
Location: Eau Claire, Wisconsin

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 5:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm gonna guess whatever the 4 bolt 240sx's run since those are RWD.. So 4x108?

I like the new hub idea. There are so many sweet wheel choices out there for so much cheaper than the Porsche wheels we need to use.

With my CGT fenders I'll probably run adaptors on the street for some nicer looking wheels then go early offset fuchs or cookies for the track (and remove the adapters).
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15511
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The scalloped rotor idea is pretty cool as a weight savings measure. Any info on how they perform compared to normal rotors?
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Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1102
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ideola wrote:
The scalloped rotor idea is pretty cool as a weight savings measure. Any info on how they perform compared to normal rotors?


They are used a lot on motorcycles. (I really thought I was going to catch grief with these as first choice to test.)

The biggest issue is less swept area but since its an upgrade from the small 4-lug solid iron hub/rotor these should perform much better. There is less swept area with drilling and slotting too. The car is being lightened so the brakes will have to work less. I was also looking at how the pad transitions over the scallops but it looks like 3/4 of the pad is always on the rotor. There will be much testing and the entire setup monitored like crazy (wear, temp, and so forth)

If I were to track the car, there are other choices for aggressive behavior.

I will report for sure.

flosho - I am making a temporary spacer adapter for the civic wheel in the back until I can get around to canning the drums. baby steps
_________________
1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car


Last edited by Mike9311 on Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:11 am; edited 1 time in total
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Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1102
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 7:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I need to add that the tire choice was agonizing between weight and performance. Tirerack publishes weight data and this is important when thinking about inertia and unsprung weight.

The choice for a long time was a Nokian but again the choice changed.

The new Conti DW will be used first. The weight is only 19lbs per tire. I will take a pic later and post. They are mounted.
_________________
1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car
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Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1102
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:47 am    Post subject: Distributor Delete Cover Reply with quote

I posted this before in the 'anything exciting thread' but I am putting here. Due to the complexities of balancing the camshaft, a new distributor delete cover was fashioned. It will also be fuel by MSll (already assembled and tested) in its first form.


_________________
1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car
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Joes924Racer  



Joined: 03 Nov 2002
Posts: 11964
Location: Oregon, Denver Colorado native!

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Awesome you da man.
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1979 porsche 924 Na
1980 porsche Turbo 931GT Replica
Have u ever driven a turbo.
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Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1102
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joes924Racer wrote:
Awesome you da man.


Thanks!

Hey I see in your avatar you hung the fender(s). How's it all looking?
_________________
1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car
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View user's profile Send private message
Mike9311  



Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1102
Location: Chicago-ish

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The backside of the cover. This setup is actually much lighter than the stock distributor holder. Like I said before the weight will come off from all over.


_________________
1980 931 since 1989
1981 Ideola 931 Club Sport
1982 931 Entwicklungsfahrzeug
1979 924 NA M650 Herausnehmbares Dach
1982 931 Red Resurrection - 951 IC
1982 931 parts car / resurrection?
1980 924 NA (R&D lightweight)
1982 931 wana-be GTR race car
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View user's profile Send private message
ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15511
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 3:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike9311 wrote:
The backside of the cover. This setup is actually much lighter than the stock distributor holder. Like I said before the weight will come off from all over.



How much to make me one of those?
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