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Which is the true 924 GTP
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jonnyclubsport  



Joined: 20 Oct 2011
Posts: 9
Location: Oxford, UK

PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 11:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the 005 car really has all the proper kit of the 006, then at 78.000 USD less than the technically inferior 1980 GTP someone has got a bit of a bargin - have they not?

I guess the complexity of the '81 GTP will put a lot of people off - in terms of potential for historic racing.
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TJC  



Joined: 04 Apr 2010
Posts: 575
Location: NW Arizona

PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2012 1:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jonnyclubsport wrote:
If the 005 car really has all the proper kit of the 006, then at 78.000 USD less than the technically inferior 1980 GTP someone has got a bit of a bargin - have they not?

I guess the complexity of the '81 GTP will put a lot of people off - in terms of potential for historic racing.


There is no doubt that 005 has an important place in Porsche history being one of two works prototypes for the 944, but I think that there are a couple of factors that affect the car's sales price...which I consider to be fair for this car.

First, most collectors desire not only rarity but in the case of a collectible race car also desire some race history. As has been documented 005 was the test "mule" for the 944 project and as such does not have the distinction of seeing the track in the heat of battle although it certainly has a provenance.

Secondly, it is probably unlikely that the car will see much action in historic racing as it's engine is one of perhaps two that currently exist and would be extremely hard to replace. When we were researching spares back in '98 we didn't find many leads, although that may have changed in the past years. I have no idea who the new owner is or what his plans are, but I'd suspect that the car will be more of a museum piece than racer...although I would love to see it on the track someday, even for an exhibition!
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Grenadiers  



Joined: 20 Feb 2007
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Location: Nelson, WI & Prescott, AZ

PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2012 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really like the exhaust manifold/turbo/wastegate setup. Mucho deniro to adapt to our 931s I bet.
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jonnyclubsport  



Joined: 20 Oct 2011
Posts: 9
Location: Oxford, UK

PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2012 6:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TJC wrote:

There is no doubt that 005 has an important place in Porsche history being one of two works prototypes for the 944, but I think that there are a couple of factors that affect the car's sales price...which I consider to be fair for this car.

First, most collectors desire not only rarity but in the case of a collectible race car also desire some race history. As has been documented 005 was the test "mule" for the 944 project and as such does not have the distinction of seeing the track in the heat of battle although it certainly has a provenance.

Secondly, it is probably unlikely that the car will see much action in historic racing as it's engine is one of perhaps two that currently exist and would be extremely hard to replace. When we were researching spares back in '98 we didn't find many leads, although that may have changed in the past years. I have no idea who the new owner is or what his plans are, but I'd suspect that the car will be more of a museum piece than racer...although I would love to see it on the track someday, even for an exhibition!


Good points, well made. I too hope the new owner is keen to get the thing out and about.

An important place in history indeed; and judging by the amount of exposure #006 gets in the Stuttgart museum, Porsche also agree.
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Trevor Ely  



Joined: 10 Sep 2010
Posts: 4
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TJC wrote:
jonnyclubsport wrote:
If the 005 car really has all the proper kit of the 006, then at 78.000 USD less than the technically inferior 1980 GTP someone has got a bit of a bargin - have they not?

I guess the complexity of the '81 GTP will put a lot of people off - in terms of potential for historic racing.


There is no doubt that 005 has an important place in Porsche history being one of two works prototypes for the 944, but I think that there are a couple of factors that affect the car's sales price...which I consider to be fair for this car.

First, most collectors desire not only rarity but in the case of a collectible race car also desire some race history. As has been documented 005 was the test "mule" for the 944 project and as such does not have the distinction of seeing the track in the heat of battle although it certainly has a provenance.

Secondly, it is probably unlikely that the car will see much action in historic racing as it's engine is one of perhaps two that currently exist and would be extremely hard to replace. When we were researching spares back in '98 we didn't find many leads, although that may have changed in the past years. I have no idea who the new owner is or what his plans are, but I'd suspect that the car will be more of a museum piece than racer...although I would love to see it on the track someday, even for an exhibition!


Agreed on the '003' vs. '005' conversation, unfortunately the provenance and race history speaks for itself, and Derek Bell's involvement certainly doesn't hurt the car's reputation. He spoke at length about this car during the weekend of the sale, and there have been a few good articles regarding the car since the sale.

You'll be happy to know, '003' now resides with your buddy in Arizona.

Regarding the fate of '005', it is actually supposedly being raced in a historic event in the very near future in the hands of Freisinger...Should be interesting to see the old wasserpumper in action! Hopefully, it all stays together and keeps it cool.
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TJC  



Joined: 04 Apr 2010
Posts: 575
Location: NW Arizona

PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 2:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trevor Ely wrote:
TJC wrote:
jonnyclubsport wrote:
If the 005 car really has all the proper kit of the 006, then at 78.000 USD less than the technically inferior 1980 GTP someone has got a bit of a bargin - have they not?

I guess the complexity of the '81 GTP will put a lot of people off - in terms of potential for historic racing.


There is no doubt that 005 has an important place in Porsche history being one of two works prototypes for the 944, but I think that there are a couple of factors that affect the car's sales price...which I consider to be fair for this car.

First, most collectors desire not only rarity but in the case of a collectible race car also desire some race history. As has been documented 005 was the test "mule" for the 944 project and as such does not have the distinction of seeing the track in the heat of battle although it certainly has a provenance.

Secondly, it is probably unlikely that the car will see much action in historic racing as it's engine is one of perhaps two that currently exist and would be extremely hard to replace. When we were researching spares back in '98 we didn't find many leads, although that may have changed in the past years. I have no idea who the new owner is or what his plans are, but I'd suspect that the car will be more of a museum piece than racer...although I would love to see it on the track someday, even for an exhibition!


Agreed on the '003' vs. '005' conversation, unfortunately the provenance and race history speaks for itself, and Derek Bell's involvement certainly doesn't hurt the car's reputation. He spoke at length about this car during the weekend of the sale, and there have been a few good articles regarding the car since the sale.

You'll be happy to know, '003' now resides with your buddy in Arizona.

Regarding the fate of '005', it is actually supposedly being raced in a historic event in the very near future in the hands of Freisinger...Should be interesting to see the old wasserpumper in action! Hopefully, it all stays together and keeps it cool.


It's great to know 003 is in good hands and I suspect that it will see quite a bit of action in historic races around the country, so 924 fans keep your eyes peeled!

As for 005, any info on when or where it will be run again will be greatly appreciated!
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'87 Porsche 944 NA "Liebchen"

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Harm  



Joined: 02 Apr 2009
Posts: 1291
Location: Holland

PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:41 am    Post subject: Re: Which is the true 924 GTP Reply with quote

TJC wrote:
Trevor Ely wrote:


A big THANKS to both of you for preserving awesome Toofah race history
C H E E R S !

Warm regards, Harm.
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Trevor Ely  



Joined: 10 Sep 2010
Posts: 4
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 3:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Which is the true 924 GTP Reply with quote

Harm wrote:
TJC wrote:
Trevor Ely wrote:


A big THANKS to both of you for preserving awesome Toofah race history
C H E E R S !

Warm regards, Harm.


Much appreciated...But, I'm sure TJC has much more to do with how 005 looks today than I!

It'll be hard to forget my last drive with 924-005...What a noise that thing makes!
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rom78  



Joined: 02 Jul 2010
Posts: 90
Location: France

PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2012 7:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

M.Ely you drove 005 what a chance

Maybe you're not hundred persons who had this chance ... The last one i know was G.LAROUSSE to the PORSCHE festival in france with 006.

Please after all those technical descriptions tell us you're feedback. It's not a big engine but i'm sure it's not ridiculous.
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Trevor Ely  



Joined: 10 Sep 2010
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trust me, it wasn't a spirited run...But, enough to wet the appetite! It's a wonderful sounding little engine, with the large diameter exhaust that it runs it makes a beat that sounds more like a large displacement motorcycle than a car! There's a clip within this video of the cars running at our shop...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLvgSlGXD7I

Also, for those taking notes...Here's an 'update' on 924-016's new home...



http://www.freisinger-motorsport.de/porsche/uk/Porsche_Restoration_Detail/2937.html


rom78 wrote:
M.Ely you drove 005 what a chance

Maybe you're not hundred persons who had this chance ... The last one i know was G.LAROUSSE to the PORSCHE festival in france with 006.

Please after all those technical descriptions tell us you're feedback. It's not a big engine but i'm sure it's not ridiculous.

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Harm  



Joined: 02 Apr 2009
Posts: 1291
Location: Holland

PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Which is the true 924 GTP Reply with quote

Quote:
http://www.freisinger-motorsport.de/porsche/uk/Porsche_Restoration_Detail/2937.html

WOW Thanks for sharing!

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TJC  



Joined: 04 Apr 2010
Posts: 575
Location: NW Arizona

PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trevor Ely wrote:
Trust me, it wasn't a spirited run...But, enough to wet the appetite! It's a wonderful sounding little engine, with the large diameter exhaust that it runs it makes a beat that sounds more like a large displacement motorcycle than a car! There's a clip within this video of the cars running at our shop...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLvgSlGXD7I

Also, for those taking notes...Here's an 'update' on 924-016's new home...



http://www.freisinger-motorsport.de/porsche/uk/Porsche_Restoration_Detail/2937.html


rom78 wrote:
M.Ely you drove 005 what a chance

Maybe you're not hundred persons who had this chance ... The last one i know was G.LAROUSSE to the PORSCHE festival in france with 006.

Please after all those technical descriptions tell us you're feedback. It's not a big engine but i'm sure it's not ridiculous.


Ah, music to my ears, thanks for sharing!
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'86 Porsche 944 Turbo...Parting Out!
'87 Porsche 944 NA "Liebchen"

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Trevor Ely  



Joined: 10 Sep 2010
Posts: 4
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Could be yours!

http://www.freisinger-motorsport.de/porsche/uk/Porsche_Cars_for_sale/224.html
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TJC  



Joined: 04 Apr 2010
Posts: 575
Location: NW Arizona

PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trevor Ely wrote:
Could be yours!

http://www.freisinger-motorsport.de/porsche/uk/Porsche_Cars_for_sale/224.html


Somehow it doesn't surprise me that it ended up in Heir Freisinger's hands as he perhaps may find the next owner who will really appreciate the uniqueness of this car, not that Mr. Edwards or Mr. Drendel didn't as they were the individuals that brought this car back to life during their ownership.

This car is probably the most unique 924, or any Porsche for that matter, available for private ownership as it is only one of two built by the factory and since Porsche has 006 in their museum I doubt that 006 would ever be available on the open market.

I certainly hope that the next caretaker of 005 appreciates what they have and I thank you Trevor for the update.
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'87 Porsche 944 NA "Liebchen"

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fifai  



Joined: 04 Dec 2008
Posts: 18
Location: France

PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is the 005 : (fore sale)

Quote:
Factory prototype, fully restored, engine type 944/71, one of only 2 cars ever produced, internal model designation 949,


http://www.freisinger-motorsport.de/porsche/uk/Porsche_Cars_for_sale/224.html?orderby=&reihenfolge=&leistung=



By the way is there any photos of the 2.5L engine 16v out of the car ?

the only one i've seen is too small :




I plan to build an 2.5L 16v turbo engine with and 951 block and a 944s head...
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