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What makes a club sport a club sport?
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15501
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:35 pm    Post subject: What makes a club sport a club sport? Reply with quote

I've decided that I want to make the Euro 931 into a "what if" project: what if Porsche made a 931 club sport?! So I've been doing some research on the various options (and option-deletes) on a few of the different official and unofficial club sport 924/944/968 variants (like the 030 package on '88 924S "SE", the 968CS, the '79 924 "S", '80 931 "S" and '88 951 "S"), and this is what I've come up with so far:
  • M471 or M030 suspension
  • Forged lightweight wheels (e.g. trash cans or club sports)
  • Upgraded brakes (???)
  • LSD
  • Manual driver side mirror, passenger side mirror delete
  • Sunroof delete
  • A/C delete
  • Script door cards
  • Manual window regulators
  • Rear wiper delete
  • Sound deadener delete
  • Sport steering wheel (my Euro 931 has the same wheel as the 951 sport wheel...363mm 4-spoker)
  • Cloth seats OR sport seats
  • Rear seat delete (a la 968CS)
I can execute everything on this list pretty easily except for the sunroof delete. Still undecided if I want to go to that expense on this car. Anything else I should add to the list?

For example...I could do an armrest delete, and put in some simple strap-style door pulls...

What else?
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88 924S SE | 82 931 Holbert | 81 Euro 931 | 81 Weissach | 80 US 928 | 80 US 931 '941' | 78 D-Prod Replica | 78 w/D-Prod kit | 78 Poli-Form | 78 Limited Edition
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CÚdric  



Joined: 27 Aug 2004
Posts: 1976
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trash cans are pretty heavy, much heavier than the cookies in the same width. Putting on m030 gear is not worth it, most of the used stuff has already gone so many miles. Bucket seats is a club sport no1 option.

You should lose some kgs just by changing the mirrors, they are awfully heavy. Sound deadner as far as the easily removable stuff. The rest is not worth it. then it will be more race than club sport. Brakes should be good with some slightly racier pads.

If you look at the real 968 club sport a neat roll bar lite that could also be fitted, and recaro profi spg seats if you have a heap of cash just laying around
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15501
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 11:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the suspension, I have a good set of adjustable Konis with coil over sleeves for the front, and will probably pickup a set of adjustable Konis for the rear. That will emulate the M471 package that was period appropriate. I also have a set of the 968 M030 sway bars and a set of 951 M030 sway bars...one set will go on this car, and one on the UWB, undecided just yet as to which goes where.

No, don't have a pile of cash for Recaro seats I'll probably keep the cloth seats that are in it, unless I get luck and can score some nice sport seats.

Agreed on the sound deadener. Will probably just remove the stuff in the rear hatch.

I should have also mentioned, I have an extra Lexan hatch and fiberglass spoiler that I may put onto this car. The goal is to have the car done by August for the Omaha meet, and to use it as a beginner's DE car to prepare me for the UWB.
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88 924S SE | 82 931 Holbert | 81 Euro 931 | 81 Weissach | 80 US 928 | 80 US 931 '941' | 78 D-Prod Replica | 78 w/D-Prod kit | 78 Poli-Form | 78 Limited Edition
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CÚdric  



Joined: 27 Aug 2004
Posts: 1976
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your UWB deserves some real adjustable ones (read elephant racing or welts . The 968 m030 will be perfect for a clubsport, to have some adjustability at the rear bar is really a +. Isnt the front one 30mm hollow if i remeber correctly, lightweigth.

On my 931 I also had some thick sound deadening carpets under the regular carpet in the rear footwell, under seat and front footwell. A couple of kilograms there. I dont have these on the n/a, difference is not that big in sound level.

Lexan hatch is a huge weight save. To bad most of the does look like crap. But i┤ve seen more expensive ones that arent that flimsy and look way better. But the weight save back there is serious whit a plastic hatch.

One thing you forgot is lighter battery, this is also a place to take away at least 5-6 kilograms and not even noticing the downsides
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Grenadiers  



Joined: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 3222
Location: Nelson, WI & Prescott, AZ

PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 11:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a set of those doors, manual windows, smallish driver-side side mirror, passenger side delete. They are out of the car and are quite heavy! Have a set of power mirrors in hand, and they don't feel too heavy, so, not sure if sourcing a set of these doors is worth it.
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15501
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 12:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My plan is to remove the two power mirrors, shave the existing doors (have body work to do anyway), and install a single manual mirror that I have in my stash.
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88 924S SE | 82 931 Holbert | 81 Euro 931 | 81 Weissach | 80 US 928 | 80 US 931 '941' | 78 D-Prod Replica | 78 w/D-Prod kit | 78 Poli-Form | 78 Limited Edition
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stevekat  



Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 718
Location: Los Angeles, CA

PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like the trash cans. Benefit is they are forged. I don't think the weight is that bad as I recall, though there may be lighter options. Best value in a wheel by far, at least until they are 'discovered.' Also 951/968 M030 type set up sounds on the money. 968 set up had coil over rear (helper springs) but the rears from the 951/968 don't match up anyway, at least without modification. Find a factory Matter light weight roll bar/cage. That would be boss! Upgrade to the M030 brakes (factory drilled rotors F and R, and big black calipers up front as on 968 M030.)
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"Never get out of the boat. Absolutely goddamn right. Unless you are goin' all the way."

Gone to new home: '81 924T, US version, CGT Intercooler, UTCIS-PT, Euro DITC, Greddy Trust MBC, Forged Fuchs Flat Dish 6's, Factory Recaro's.
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CÚdric  



Joined: 27 Aug 2004
Posts: 1976
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 3:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I tried to bid on a set of trash cans on ebay.de some days ago, the auction ended about 550$(4wheels incl tyres), a couple of hundred dollars more than i want to pay . I guess they are way cheaper over there
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stevekat  



Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 718
Location: Los Angeles, CA

PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 3:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think they typically go for $100 to $200 U.S. for a nice set without accounting for tire quality, if tires are included at all. I've also purchased two sets of 7's and 8's for this amount, let alone the 6's for our 931's.
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"Never get out of the boat. Absolutely goddamn right. Unless you are goin' all the way."

Gone to new home: '81 924T, US version, CGT Intercooler, UTCIS-PT, Euro DITC, Greddy Trust MBC, Forged Fuchs Flat Dish 6's, Factory Recaro's.
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15501
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevekat wrote:
Like the trash cans. Benefit is they are forged.

Agreed. I have a line on a set of staggered Club Sports too. So I could use Club Sports for street use, put a set of dry track tires on the Trash Cans I just snagged with that 931 "S" up in Saginaw, and then put a set of rain track tires on the black spider webs that came with the car. Should be a nice setup! If the Club Sports will fit...if not, I have a set of D90s as backup for the street...

Here's a question...wondering if it would be in the "spirit" of a club sport to swap in rear alu trailing arms...would reduce weight and facilitate coil overs should the need or desire ever arise...
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88 924S SE | 82 931 Holbert | 81 Euro 931 | 81 Weissach | 80 US 928 | 80 US 931 '941' | 78 D-Prod Replica | 78 w/D-Prod kit | 78 Poli-Form | 78 Limited Edition
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stevekat  



Joined: 19 Jan 2008
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Location: Los Angeles, CA

PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 3:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would this also let you use later shocks? If so, I'd say sure. Also, it would seem to meet the criteria for the purpose of Club Sport if they are lighter.
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"Never get out of the boat. Absolutely goddamn right. Unless you are goin' all the way."

Gone to new home: '81 924T, US version, CGT Intercooler, UTCIS-PT, Euro DITC, Greddy Trust MBC, Forged Fuchs Flat Dish 6's, Factory Recaro's.
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15501
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevekat wrote:
Would this also let you use later shocks?

Yep, here are late offset arms on the UWB. As you can see, the rear shocks are setup for coilovers, although at this point, I have chosen not to add them to the UWB. From my experience in bolting these up, it was a piece of cake...change the trailing arm, and no issues using the later shock stuff from 944/951. I presume that the 968 stuff is interchangeable as well, although I've not 100% verified it.

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88 924S SE | 82 931 Holbert | 81 Euro 931 | 81 Weissach | 80 US 928 | 80 US 931 '941' | 78 D-Prod Replica | 78 w/D-Prod kit | 78 Poli-Form | 78 Limited Edition
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brealytrent  



Joined: 28 Dec 2008
Posts: 414
Location: Goldsboro, NC

PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 4:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CÚdric wrote:
Trash cans are pretty heavy,


Agreed
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stevekat  



Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 718
Location: Los Angeles, CA

PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 4:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That looks great. Yes, my understanding is 968 is bolt up for 951.

This is the 968 shock with the helper spring.


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"Never get out of the boat. Absolutely goddamn right. Unless you are goin' all the way."

Gone to new home: '81 924T, US version, CGT Intercooler, UTCIS-PT, Euro DITC, Greddy Trust MBC, Forged Fuchs Flat Dish 6's, Factory Recaro's.
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stevekat  



Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 718
Location: Los Angeles, CA

PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 4:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Re: Trash cans, how much do you think they weigh? While not the lightest, I've always felt they are very good on the weight front, particularly related to their strength as being forged. I have weighed a 7 x 16 and it appears to come in at 18.5 (not using the most accurate method.) I've seen charts that say the 8 x 16 is 20, so one might extrapolate the 6 x 16 down to as little as 17lbs. I am not really sure I can point to any OEM wheel that is significantly lighter, for its size.
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"Never get out of the boat. Absolutely goddamn right. Unless you are goin' all the way."

Gone to new home: '81 924T, US version, CGT Intercooler, UTCIS-PT, Euro DITC, Greddy Trust MBC, Forged Fuchs Flat Dish 6's, Factory Recaro's.
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