924Board.org

[kenchuk]

I'm looking to buy a 931, I'm in Winnipeg, Canada. Just wondering what should I be looking for in terms of problems or good things when I am checking out cars. Any help would be appreciated.

Ken
81 N/A
Hopefully soon a turbo.

[larso]

Well almost all 931s have bad turbos, people don't drive them, and the seals go hard.

Wastegate usually rusts shut too.

When you test drive them watch for white burnt smelling smoke, under full throttle...white smoke upon start up.

Of course bad gas can always confuse you to hell because you see stinky sour smelling white and black and grey stuff...

When you test drive, if the car cuts out under full throttle the waste gate might be stuck (rusted inside) if it seems to be going really fast before it cuts out.


Floor the car and see how everything acts.

Make sure there are records if the owner is claiming low miles, since these odo's are useless in every possible way on these cars for a true reading.

Ask if the turbo has been rebuilt, i think they need to be rebuilt every 70 K miles or something in general.

Do they have bottles of synthetic oil in their garage?

Oil pressure; well again the oil pressure gauges on these cars are pretty much useless...so if it shows bad oil pressure it doesn't neccessarily mean its bad oil pressure.

Hrm what else, if it has drums at the back and 14 inch wheels, WHINE about it and act shocked that such a terrible thing could happen like that.

Check to see if it is an authentic 931...check serial number, some people throw 924 turbo engines in 924s.

If it's an 80 beware of 1st and 2nd gear in the transmission to be horrible for gronching.

Decide what year you are going to get, 81-82s have more reliable turbos than the early 80s turbos, but weaker power build up for a turbo, easier to drive around town, plus the higher comp pistons help for town driving too. Digital ignition on later ones too...
Some of the 80s turbos have the updated seals, so i think the later 80 turbos are the same as 81-82s for reliabilty (but the 80 has the power advantage). You can check the number on the turbo plate.

Check for cracks in the exhaust manifold, if they are big enough that you can easily see them without looking closely, beware.

Check bottom exhaust, but at least if you need to replace the exhaust you won't have to worry about the expensive cat. converter since you live in manitoba.

[John Mueller]

I just found a clean 931 nearby me, I am going Saturday to pick her up and test drive. They want $1900 USD, is this good? I already left a deposit since I bought my NA for $1200 and it was in good shape other than what I caused when I was young and stupid. I am not sure of the year yet.

[Rick MacLaren]

Bottom line: For any 931 you get, regardless of the purchase price, it's going to cost you $10,000 Canadian, or $6000 USD, in total dollars (i.e., purchase price plus repairs over the first year) to make it right.

The fact is inescapable. It doesn't matter if you have a relative that will give his life for your car, or a hoist, or air tools and MIG and TIG and freaking Husky parts washers and sleeping with the Porsche dealer's wife and a direct line to Ferdinand's grave...you're still going to spend that much money to make your car right. It's wishful thinking or foolishness to assume you'll spend less.

I wouldn't buy a 931 for under $5000 Canadian or $3000 USD because frankly it'll be like dating a damaged woman - all work and lonely nights. And if I did knock my head against something and spend less than $5000 on a 931, I'd still plan on spending an extra $5000 over the next year to work out the bugs.

Typical Example:

May. A guy buys a 931 for $5000 CDN. Mint. Clean dash, clean carpet, seats, headliner. It's just exquisite. It runs perfectly for 2 months. Then it blows the rubber boot in the wastegate. $200 for uninstall and reinstall of the wastegate, $50 for the boot, and say $50 for the reconditioning of the wastegate.

July. Oil leak. Small at first, but at idle it spews litres of oil on the ground. If you're smart enough and fast enough to get to turn it off in time, before it blows the engine, you now have to diagnose the problem. It turns out to be a $400 USD pipe. But it's the gaskets, O rings and nuts and bolts that kill you when the bill is finally tallied, $1300.

August. Your bearings go on the right rear wheel. But it's stupid to replace one bearing and not the bearing on the other side. So a couple of hundred dollars later you've got new bearings. Further complicating matters, your half shafts need to be reversed or replaced. Extra labour for the mechanic unless you have a hoist at home. Oh! Sorry! Maybe you like lying on your back while road dirt falls into your hair and eyes. In that case, Yes, you can do the work yourself. But remember, while you're under the car, all the other boys and girls are having fun and living normal lives while you live the life of a horizontal, lyin' in yer driveway inverted greasy-assed wrench monkey. Do you wonder why your neighbors don't invite you over for drinks?

Sept. Emergency brake doesn't work anymore. And it turns out to be a master cylinder on the left rear. So all braking is affected. Cost? $75 to do it yourself. Not including the $25 in misc parts like brake cleaner, brake fluid, a spring, etc.

October. You're racing a Mitsibushi 3000 GT on the 401 (Oh sure you won't go fast in your new Porsche now will you? You're a good boy!). You take him, but after 3 kilometers at normal highway speed (140 KPH) you blow a big-assed wad of oil out the back and your embarrassment is only exceeded by the thick waft of blue smoke billowing into your face and on your clothes and you hope and pray to the Lord Jesus it won't result in a flaming car. $250 for the tow and $825 in repairs later, you're seeing red...

October. Ya get into your car on the 30th of October at 6 AM, and you realize you've worn your brake drums. Estimated cost? Probably a hundred bucks if ya do the labour yerself.

Get the idea?
_________________
1980 Porsche 931 C2H5OH/H2O injected 15 PSI
1979 Porsche 924

[ This Message was edited by: Rick MacLaren on 2001-10-30 23:13 ]

[Zuffen]

Rick your mostly right and a little wrong.

Seems that these cars have souls.

I blew one headgasket and ruined the head on my "was" favorite silver 931 and then after doing the rebuild this happened again to my friend who blew it on hot day. Long story, and I'm not happy about it. The car is still sitting waiting for a priest to perform an exorcism..

But then I have my 82 daily driver for the last two years. Wrecked car, I did some panel replacements, thought I had a blown engine after some ticking, turned out to be bad seals in the blowoff valve. Thought I had a a bad fuel system after I sputtered to a stop in no cell phone signal middle of the boonies Arkansas, was water in the fuel and it spit it out after a few tanks.

I've replaced the plugs wires and vacumm hoses, air filter. And one rear wheel bearing, the other side is waiting.

Other than that no problems other than an upside down heater valve.

Great car revs to redline, spins tires into third.

Yes it needs paint and a new drivers seat (cracked out leather)but she hasn't been as much as a nightmare as the pristene 81 aformetnioned. maybe a driven daily car is the better bet even in rough shape looks wise

_________________
Bob Dodd - 924turbo@cox.net
931 1982, 944 1982 euro, 924S 1988SE, 93 968 tip 06 Silver Cayenne S, 06 Black Cayenne S

I have Way too many cars, parts for the 931,944 and 951

[Rick MacLaren]

Yeah Bob you're right, they do have souls.
And I don't mean to slag the car or imply that you can't get a good one. My 924 non turbo is awesome and quite reliable. But I've put some bux there too.

Say, I've got this wicked 'tick tick tick' sound that some have speculated is coming from my valves on my 931, but I've checked the valve adjustments and the noise is still there.

Can you tell me Bob about the O ring at the blow off valve? Did you think the sound was eminating from there when you first heard the sound? Or did you think it was your valves? What was the cost to teardown and put in another O ring?

[John Mueller]

I could not resist the car for $1900 USD. The only oil I cound find on the motor was where they spilt the oil filling the car. I am having the car towed home where I am going to pull the motor apart. I am not going to start her until I pull the turbo, and components. Replace everything that is rubber or looks like a hose. And then fix the only dent on the car, which is very small. I have never seen a motor so clean, it is like it never had oil in it, there is no grime anywhere in the compartment. It is almost spooky, my NA was a greasy mess when I got it. Well back to work.

[teo]

John,

it's time to update your signature list




[ This Message was edited by: teo on 2001-11-01 05:39 ]

[bacook]

My '82 Turbo definitely has an evil spirit on board! I bought it a year ago with a brand new paint job, new interior, new shocks, tires and brakes for $1300. It needed a throw out bearing and manifold to turbo gasket which I replaced immediately.

Well, one year later I've driven it a total of 68 miles, had the head rebuilt, replaced the head gasket for a second time, and spent hundreds of hours under and over it and it still runs like crap! Keep in mind that my non-turbo has never missed a day of work and runs like a champ.

I originally intended to make the 931 my daily driver while I converted my NA for track duty. Now I've had to get an old Acura for a daily driver because I cannot get the damn turbo running properly. I think the demons that possess it feed off of frustration, so I'm going to let it sit for a while and maybe they'll get bored and leave!

[924RACR]

OK, what have you not touched???

_________________
Vaughan Scott
Webmeister
'79 924 #77 SCCA H Prod racecar
'82 931 Plat. Silver
#25 Hidari Firefly P2 sports prototype

[bacook]

I think I just need a break from the Turbo for a while to properly diagnose it. I feel like I've done everything but obviously I haven't . Don't worry, though. My new Integra won't be getting the rice treatment. Nothing more than some TypeR stickers and neon lights that flash in time with the music!

bc

[RobE]

I bought a '79 N/A about a year ago and have no major problems thus far(other than the ones I produce) The only thing that was wrong with it is that the windshield wipers work on their own. Other than that No problems. It is possible to get a good reliable 924 you just have to look. Oh I only paid $2800 for it and the interior and paint were in excellant condition

[924RACR]

I had the same problem with the wipers on my 931; I ran an extra ground cable from the steering column and the problem went away, never to return.

Specifically, what I did, after removing the gauge cluster for access (which entailed removing the steering wheel), was to run a wire from the pinch bolt which holds the steering lock gear in place (using a ring terminal) to one of the mounting brackets for one of the ECU's under the steering column. The bracket is welded to the body, and forms a good ground path. You may have to find other options in an NA.

I have also had that problem occasionally on my '79 NA racecar. However, not recently, so I haven't messed w/ it.

HTH...

_________________
Vaughan Scott
Webmeister
'79 924 #77 SCCA H Prod racecar
'82 931 Plat. Silver
#25 Hidari Firefly P2 sports prototype

[RobE]

Thanks I'll see if I can try somthing simular.