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Spark plugs and wires

 
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bureau13  



Joined: 07 Sep 2017
Posts: 204
Location: South Florida

PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2019 7:05 am    Post subject: Spark plugs and wires Reply with quote

I bought some colder plugs and a new set of wires, since when I pulled the boot off of one of the existing plugs, the clip stayed with the plug. Maybe that's not a big deal but I found it alarming and I don't know how old they are so it seemed prudent.

Unfortunately, my Franken-car has a distributor of unknown origin instead of the DITC system it came with. The connectors that attach to the distributor are nothing like the ones that came on my new wire set. The terminals on the distributor protrude and look sort of like the end of a spark plug. The proper boot extends down over this, with the clip connector inside recessed inside the boot. The new wires have connectors that stick out from the boots and are relatively long, so I'm guessing that wherever they connect with the DITC ignition, the connector itself is recessed so this new longer connector can fit down inside it.

So what wires do I really need? And will Kingsborne exchange them? I need to post some pictures of what I'm describing I guess...
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-----------------------------------------
1982 931
1986.5 Silver 928S
2007 Hummer H3 (Daily Driver)

Past lives (I miss them all):
2004 RX-8 (Wrecked)
1993 RX-7 (Sold)
1987 RX-7 Turbo II (Sold)
1985 RX-7 GSL (Stolen)
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Fifty50Plus  



Joined: 28 Feb 2008
Posts: 1065
Location: Washington DC area

PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2019 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you sure you don't just have an oddball distributor cap?
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1979 924 NA race car
1982 924 NA race car - Sold
1982 924 Turbo almost a PoS
1981 924 Turbo a real PoS, new engine
1982 924 Turbo nice body, blown engine
1972 911 E race car - going to Vintage
Various 944s to become IT-S race car
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924RACR  



Joined: 29 Jul 2001
Posts: 8236
Location: Royal Oak, MI, USA

PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2019 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I'm thinking that's the wrong cap... never seen a 924 with a cap like that.
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'79 924 #77 ITB racecar
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bureau13  



Joined: 07 Sep 2017
Posts: 204
Location: South Florida

PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 12:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK I may be showing some ignorance here. My car is the only 931 I've ever seen closely. The S2 cars with DITC...I thought they had no distributor? Or is it simply that they have no mechanical or vacuum advance? Is it possible I could put on a new cap, without having to put in an entirely new distributor?

Note that I also have a vacuum advance on this, but no second nipple which I think is some sort of retard mechanism, or am I wrong about that?

I guess I was making some assumptions that may not be correct. It's definitely an oddball cap...but I thought the whole thing was an aftermarket setup used to make up for ripping out the DITC system.
_________________
-----------------------------------------
1982 931
1986.5 Silver 928S
2007 Hummer H3 (Daily Driver)

Past lives (I miss them all):
2004 RX-8 (Wrecked)
1993 RX-7 (Sold)
1987 RX-7 Turbo II (Sold)
1985 RX-7 GSL (Stolen)
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Johann  



Joined: 07 Aug 2016
Posts: 220
Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 1:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your distributor cap should look like this


I think you have this and it is wrong



A distributor with vacuum advance should not be used in combination with DITC. A DITC distributor is empty inside with only a rotor and distributor cap to send spark to the plugs.

If you have one with vacuum advance like the one below you have an S1
distributor.



UNLESS

You have the distributor from Mittelmotor that eliminates the DITC.

This is the distributor from Mittelmotor

[img][/img]
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bureau13  



Joined: 07 Sep 2017
Posts: 204
Location: South Florida

PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 1:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you've nailed it! My cap is not EXACTLY the one shown in the Bosch picture, but close...the terminals are definitely like that.

Now, my distributor has that vacuum advance pod on the side, so it may be a S1 distributor (DITC has definitely been removed, and the vacuum line to the advance is interrupted by some sort of solenoid, presumably it's being switched on/off based on whether or not the advance is "on" or not...but I haven't been able to characterize what exactly that's doing). I thought an S1 distributor had two vacuum ports though? But maybe that's incorrect.

I guess if I DO have an S1 distributor, I can simply buy a new correct cap. I'm intrigued by that Mittelmotor distributor though...
_________________
-----------------------------------------
1982 931
1986.5 Silver 928S
2007 Hummer H3 (Daily Driver)

Past lives (I miss them all):
2004 RX-8 (Wrecked)
1993 RX-7 (Sold)
1987 RX-7 Turbo II (Sold)
1985 RX-7 GSL (Stolen)
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Carrera RSR  



Joined: 08 Jan 2010
Posts: 1903
Location: Somerset, UK

PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looking at all your posts, your car sounds like a right miss mash of parts. You have lots of challenges when a previous owner has bodged so much and you have no idea if what has been done is working well or giving you potential problems. There is probably some fundamental ignition/running issues which need resolving. Potentially ripping out bodges and starting again with knowledge you are installing the right set up. More so if you have aspirations for more power/boost/performance out of this car. Switching to colder plugs when the car has running and boost issues is not going to help you. Fix the bodges first....
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1980 931 - forged pistons, Piper cam, K27/26 3257 6.10 hybrid turbo, 951 FMIC, custom intake, Mittelmotor dizzy & cam pulley, H&S exhaust, GAZ Gold, Fuch'ed, Quaife
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bureau13  



Joined: 07 Sep 2017
Posts: 204
Location: South Florida

PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2019 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I switched to colder plugs because that was recommended and I was pretty sure I needed to switch plugs anyway.

You're right, someone was in there doing a lot of stuff, and I have no idea if they knew what they were doing or not. I'm starting to get some theories
_________________
-----------------------------------------
1982 931
1986.5 Silver 928S
2007 Hummer H3 (Daily Driver)

Past lives (I miss them all):
2004 RX-8 (Wrecked)
1993 RX-7 (Sold)
1987 RX-7 Turbo II (Sold)
1985 RX-7 GSL (Stolen)
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bureau13  



Joined: 07 Sep 2017
Posts: 204
Location: South Florida

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 2:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've taken some pictures of the distributor, cap and rotor that I have. The cap is much taller than the stock cap (I ordered one of those, not even close to fitting this distributor). The rotor also is completely different. It obviously fits the car, but I can't find any part numbers or any pics online that match it. Any ideas? I didn't think to remove the wires to show a picture of the terminals on the cap, but they're very similar to the ones shown above as the wrong cap, with what look a lot like spark plug ends.

The pictures are here: https://photos.app.goo.gl/RcVZ6gngqmczREN66

If anyone has any clues about what this might be, I would greatly appreciate it.
_________________
-----------------------------------------
1982 931
1986.5 Silver 928S
2007 Hummer H3 (Daily Driver)

Past lives (I miss them all):
2004 RX-8 (Wrecked)
1993 RX-7 (Sold)
1987 RX-7 Turbo II (Sold)
1985 RX-7 GSL (Stolen)
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Fasteddie313  



Joined: 29 Sep 2013
Posts: 1853
Location: MI

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 2:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I haven't seen anything like that on a 24 before..
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bureau13  



Joined: 07 Sep 2017
Posts: 204
Location: South Florida

PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 2:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FYI someone on Rennlist has identified it as being from an early '80s Ford Ranger. Sure enough, the pictures on RockAuto look identical. It seems like a bizarrely random choice, but hey, I guess it worked.
_________________
-----------------------------------------
1982 931
1986.5 Silver 928S
2007 Hummer H3 (Daily Driver)

Past lives (I miss them all):
2004 RX-8 (Wrecked)
1993 RX-7 (Sold)
1987 RX-7 Turbo II (Sold)
1985 RX-7 GSL (Stolen)
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bureau13  



Joined: 07 Sep 2017
Posts: 204
Location: South Florida

PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FWIW, I have no replaced my distributor cap and rotor, plugs and wires, and the car is running much better now. Very pleased with my Ford Ranger ignition

One thing I've been noticing (it's not new) is when I accelerate and start building boost, there's a point...usually close to where full boost would be if my wastegate was opening as it should, ie around 6-8 psi...where I can feel the car pull back. I don't know how else to describe it. I don't know if something is going on with the vacuum advance, or if maybe I'm detonating (seems weird to do that at fairly low boost/low revs though, considering it seems to get better). I do need to put a wideband on this thing to see what's what....
_________________
-----------------------------------------
1982 931
1986.5 Silver 928S
2007 Hummer H3 (Daily Driver)

Past lives (I miss them all):
2004 RX-8 (Wrecked)
1993 RX-7 (Sold)
1987 RX-7 Turbo II (Sold)
1985 RX-7 GSL (Stolen)
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Carrera RSR  



Joined: 08 Jan 2010
Posts: 1903
Location: Somerset, UK

PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 4:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So your Ford Ranger distributor has been set up to give you boost related advance/retard through the rev range as per Porsche specifications??
_________________
1980 931 - forged pistons, Piper cam, K27/26 3257 6.10 hybrid turbo, 951 FMIC, custom intake, Mittelmotor dizzy & cam pulley, H&S exhaust, GAZ Gold, Fuch'ed, Quaife
Now www.924board.org/viewtopic.php?t=34690
Then www.924board.org/viewtopic.php?t=31252
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bureau13  



Joined: 07 Sep 2017
Posts: 204
Location: South Florida

PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't actually know anything about how it was set up (or how Porsche set up the stock cars), or why. I'm not sure how to find out, either. It does have a vacuum advance which is connected, but it goes to what is generally used as an EGR valve. Since connecting it directly to the vacuum source elevates the idle rpm, and routing it through this valve does not, I assume this is intended to bypass the vacuum advance at idle. I've thought of a a few ways to try to verify this theory but I haven't done so yet. For all I know it's doing nothing and there is actually no working vacuum advance at the moment. I did disconnect it once and drive around, and at least in my head I felt like it was making a difference.
_________________
-----------------------------------------
1982 931
1986.5 Silver 928S
2007 Hummer H3 (Daily Driver)

Past lives (I miss them all):
2004 RX-8 (Wrecked)
1993 RX-7 (Sold)
1987 RX-7 Turbo II (Sold)
1985 RX-7 GSL (Stolen)
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