Show full size 924Board.org
Discussion Forum of 924.org
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
 Technical FAQ924 FAQ (Technical)   Technical924 Technical Section   Jump to 924.org924.org   Jump to PCA 924 Registry924 Registry

Stage Next...
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    924Board.org Forum Index -> Performance Upgrades
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Fasteddie313  



Joined: 29 Sep 2013
Posts: 1556
Location: MI

PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 7:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Painted the airbox with black BBQ paint since I had it..
Then a couple days later I was pressure testing a gauge off of my FD, leaked a bit and wiped the paint right off my airbox like nothing
So I painted it more with the same stuff, lol.. Atleast I know gas will take it right off once I line up some fuel resistant paint to redo it..

I put my GM IAT in the CSV location.. I made a flange to take the IAT and match the intake bolt holes so the IAT threads into the flange, flange bolts in the IAT spot, IAT open element sticks through the hole the CSV used to go through.. Used more of that aluminum I used on my distributor adapter, that thick stuff..
Calibrated easy 79 degrees today..

My coolant temp sensor... I have been going crazy trying to calibrate it..
It turns out that it is the coolant gauge sensor for the BMW and not the DME coolant sensor..
Information on it is a bit rare but I found the numbers and BAM, reads about 1 degree colder than the IAT..
91ish-95 e36 temp gauge sensor (black one, not the blue one) fits in the 931 thermotime switch spot in the back of the head coolant lines housing perfect, the resistance numbers are in my post above incase.

The MTX-L wont calibrate perfectly for me but I have it spot on in the operating range, it gets a bit off up in the 20's at its limit but I should never need its reading up there..

So that's all my sensors done and working on my prototype harness..

Flushed the coolant system super good while I had it apart for that sensor..

Thinking about mounting a smallerish laptop to my center console vertical keyboard and all..
I think a smaller obsolete dirt cheap laptop running tunerstudio off a lite linux distro would be the ticket..
_________________
80 Turbo - Slightly Modified
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
Noahs944  



Joined: 08 Dec 2015
Posts: 720
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I been there done that with locking myself out the hood.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Noahs944  



Joined: 08 Dec 2015
Posts: 720
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Love your idea about the dedicated mini laptop console. One idea might be mounted in the glove compartment on sliding rails like a tool box drawer but at a workable height for a passenger to operate while driving. That was something I wanted for my car a few years ago with the piggyback system I bought, but didn't pan out. You can have the laptop on a turn table so it can work for your passenger or driver.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Fasteddie313  



Joined: 29 Sep 2013
Posts: 1556
Location: MI

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Noahs944 wrote:
I been there done that with locking myself out the hood.


Speaking of..
My headlight crank arm caught the hood release cable the other day! Good thing the hood was up..

It put a good kink in the cable so I REALLY don't trust it now..
My headlight motor hasn't sounded the same since
It stopped it dead and now the gears are louder..

Hey, I have to make a new hood latch cable now anyway.. So I might as well get it out of the way of my ram air while I'm at it..
It's not on the top of the list..
_________________
80 Turbo - Slightly Modified
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
Fasteddie313  



Joined: 29 Sep 2013
Posts: 1556
Location: MI

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Put the car back together from the oilpan gasket job..
While I was at it I redid my boost piping from my turbo to my intercooler.. I have it much higher now and eliminated a 2.5" 90 pipe and 2.5-3" straight reducer in favor of a 2.5-3" 90 reducer that saves a lot of space.. I also shortened my S hose off the compressor..

Now my horns fit back in their original location! So I put my horns back on and they work good..

Also, for the first time I took a peek at putting my bellypan back on.. It will fit back on fine other than a little bit of modification to the straight sides by the swaybars..
I need to check thoroughly for leaks before I do that though..

The bellypan is supposed to improve engine cooling and high speed aero right?
I think so..

Now I have to go buy a bunch of oil to dump into it and I should put a new filter on it while I remember..

Hopefully it will hold oil now so I can run it!!!!!!!!

BTW does anyone know how deep to put the oil dipstick into the oil pan for it to be correct? Mine doesn't have any good marks to tell where it was before or anything..
_________________
80 Turbo - Slightly Modified
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
CÚdric  



Joined: 27 Aug 2004
Posts: 1740
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any pics of the improved piping?

My friend tried with and without belly pan, removing it significantly reduced oil temps. But it sure helps high speed aero under the front.
_________________
┤79 924
http://www.garaget.org/show.php?car=211
┤80 924 Turbo
http://www.garaget.org/?car=160275
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
Fasteddie313  



Joined: 29 Sep 2013
Posts: 1556
Location: MI

PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For Cedric












I have the straight edge from the crossmember to the bottom of the front valance.. IC pipes are higher than ground clearance..








_________________
80 Turbo - Slightly Modified
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
Fasteddie313  



Joined: 29 Sep 2013
Posts: 1556
Location: MI

PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pulled an engine today..

Then I burnt a few gallons of gas in the Porsche today!! Road testing..
No leaks

Well, the GF was driving 90% of the time with me in the passengers seat trying to tune the VE table..
It's going well, I have it staying within about 1 AFR of my target with no EGO correction.. I figured that out too a bit..

We did a few full boost pulls (US S1 Spring) in the lower 12s to upper 11s at higher RPM and it's putting the AFR where I want it and holding steady..

It's just really hard to see it, decide which way to adjust it, how much, and make adjustments, while staying in the same place on the map..
It seems to extrapolate pretty well so with a smooth map I can bump up/down whole sections and smooth it out, and it delivers..

This is about what I have so far..

100kpa = WOT no boost
150kpa= 7.25psi boost 200kpa=14.5psi boost


But I've only been into it up to touching the 145kpa boxes and up to the 5400 rpm boxes so far.. The rest is just a guess/safetynet..

I was trying to tune it to where it was taking more fuel away at idle rather than adding more fuel everywhere else, but it doesn't seem to like that too much..

It is ok at taking away a little fuel, down to the mid 90's in the VE table it is fine, but below that it gets too touchy..

I was trying to set my idle very rich with the AFR screw and then take that fuel away to get the rest of the map closer to 100.. I got frusterated..

So I unplugged the fuel distributor from the tuner, set my idle with it in its natural state, bumped my whole map up, and started over..

Night and day difference, it runs awesome..
It eats anything in the usual AFR range without sputtering or complaining.. I'm still trying to really dial in my AFRs but I have it within 1 AFR of my target pretty much everywhere on the map now..

I have been doing all of my drive testing and tuning with no EGO control (live AFR targeting) or any accel enrichment, but I have been playing with EGO control..

EGO control makes it follow my AFR target map giving or taking some where the VE table isn't perfect for it's current conditions, and from initial testing, it does a darn good job!!

I was playing with it, having EGO on, and changing my AFR map, and with no changed to the VE table it will put me at whatever AFR I tell it to +- atleast 2 AFR.. I did not observe it's limit..
I even got it to idle smoothly in the 14s with EGO.

Here is my AFR target map..


I need to make it less columns at low RPMs..

Besides the idle area, what do you think of that for a target map?
It's my wishlist of what AFR I want where..
Do you have any input as to what AFR I should want where? Advice?
Look good?

I think 9s at 300kpa is probably too rich, but I'm not planning on running at 300kpa, just 9s for overboost safety..
I'm not convinced cutting fuel on a boost spike or rev limit is a good idea..

I hope this thing will run up into the 250kpa range some day however, so what do you think mostly up to there?
I'm not going to start turning my boost back up at all until I have ran it hard on the spring for a while and get it tuned up to the spring very good..
I'm also questioning my MAP sensor's accuracy so something might be up with that..
It is saying I am a couple psi shy in boost from what it is running says my auto meter boost gauge..
Actually I am suspicious that I got ripped off on ebay and got a 1 bar sensor and I'm just maxing it out..


I need some rare engine bay beauty pics..
Most all of my pics/video are for information purposes rather than to be pretty..

My coolant temp gets hotter idling than any of my pulls..
figured I'd throw that in there..

Also imgur is a real pita to resize pics with these days.. Something is glitching or something..
_________________
80 Turbo - Slightly Modified
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
CÚdric  



Joined: 27 Aug 2004
Posts: 1740
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great that things are going forward! It looks a bit rich though, do you need to go that rich for knock or egt?
_________________
┤79 924
http://www.garaget.org/show.php?car=211
┤80 924 Turbo
http://www.garaget.org/?car=160275
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
morghen  



Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 7870
Location: Romania

PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Really cool to see old tech revised like this.
_________________
red 924 and not red 924
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Fasteddie313  



Joined: 29 Sep 2013
Posts: 1556
Location: MI

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 12:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CÚdric wrote:
Great that things are going forward! It looks a bit rich though, do you need to go that rich for knock or egt?


I don't have knock or EGT sensors but I do plan on making a "det can" headphone setup for when I actually start pushing it..

It's probably a bit rich for a couple reasons..
1 because I am still trying to get in the ballpark of a safe VE map, but I think I'm close to that now..
2 because I'm a tuning baby and don't really know what I'm doing..


Last night I watched a very long motec presentation about how to tune PID settings, for EGO control in my case..
I also did some research on using EGO control and TPS based accel enrichment while making logs to be analyzed by VE analyze in megalogviewer..

It tuns out that you can run EGO control, live AFR targeting,
and the analyzer will automatically compensate for the EGO trim it puts in while analyzing my logs to help me refine my AFR maps..

So I'm going to try to tune PID EGO control next and then take some good long logs and run them through the analyzer..

No, I don't have the VEAL, VE Analyze Live, "autotune" features of the paid versions of the megasquirt software yet.. It's like $130 for the full paid software upgrade..

I know I should buy it and probably will eventually..
It is hard and I'm not great at it yet but I think it will make me smarter faster being forced to do it myself..
Steep learning curve and it really makes me realize why a dyno is so preferred, because it all happens so fast..

I also found out that my IAT sensor doesn't work for crap where I have it.. It is basically just measuring the temp of my intake manifold rather than the air in my intake manifold..
On a boost pull it will read something like 95 degrees to start and then by the end of the pull it has slowly stepped down to 85-90 degrees,
then after the pull it gradually goes back up to like 95 degrees..
_________________
80 Turbo - Slightly Modified
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
Fasteddie313  



Joined: 29 Sep 2013
Posts: 1556
Location: MI

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 1:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is a little pull to almost 5k.. No EGO, accel, or anything, just straight VE table open loop..



See my middle vertical line/courser on the top, that hits 3070 RPM and it's already in full boost..
I think that pull started from pulling against the breaks but the boost is coming on 100s of RPM under 3k..
Just noticed that.. Not too shabby..

See my MAP maxing out at 129.. White line on top.. It should be higher, more like 150.. Have to test it with compressed air and stuff.. My actual boost gauge reads 6-7 psi..

My AFR target is in the 11s there but it was running pretty steady 12s so I added a bit more VE up there since then.. I think 12s are safe in that boost anyway, getting close..
The chart scales between the AFR and AFR target are not the same because max target is 14.5 but actual AFR goes very lean when I get completely off the throttle and just coast down.. Like CIS has a natural fuel cut overrun or something.. See the yellow spike right after the pull on top (AFR) with the yellow drop on bottom (TPS).. GF is a little shy with the loud pedal so you can see she didn't hold 100% TPS WOT right to the end..

See my MAT, white line on bottom, just going down during a pull.. It must be just picking up the temperature of the manifold itself cooling off with a lot of air flow.. Max 98 min 93 for that log so it stays way too steady to be actual intake air temp I think.. So I think my IAT adapter I made is a fail.. Fails happen sometimes when I make things.. I just don't really want to drill that huge hole in my intake, but it looks like I will, or something, undecided..

But yeah see, my AFR is pretty steady and close to where I want it, so I am getting there and the tool is doing its job..
_________________
80 Turbo - Slightly Modified
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
CÚdric  



Joined: 27 Aug 2004
Posts: 1740
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 1:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yup, a load controlled dyno is golden to have for tuning, as you quickly notice. I think you learn really quickly, and its not the most exotic engine, so a good place to learn engine tuning.

If i were you i would push the enrichment a bit higher up in the boost range. Remember afr 11 at 170kpa is what a standard non intercooled euro engine runs. With intercooler you should be able to run a bit leaner while still being safer, and below that it should be possible to run a bit leaner aswell.. Assuming you arent running ignition that aggressive.

I will try to aim for afr 11 at 200kpa when I'm up and running if its possible, hopefully i can get it a bit leaner below that, if the system will do what i want it to do.

Det cans can be a good tool, especially if you are playing a round with ignition timing.
_________________
┤79 924
http://www.garaget.org/show.php?car=211
┤80 924 Turbo
http://www.garaget.org/?car=160275
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
CÚdric  



Joined: 27 Aug 2004
Posts: 1740
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 1:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks pretty steady, is the boost gauge and sensor in the same position? , GF in the driver's seat while tuning, what a good way to spend some time together
_________________
┤79 924
http://www.garaget.org/show.php?car=211
┤80 924 Turbo
http://www.garaget.org/?car=160275
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
Fasteddie313  



Joined: 29 Sep 2013
Posts: 1556
Location: MI

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 4:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Went and made a decent log with a lot of cruising and a little pulling, with EGO on and working pretty good.
Then I ran it through analyze and it took a bit of fuel out of my map..

As compared, see the big blue section in the middle it made. It leaned all of that out..
I did smooth it out a bit with the 3d map but in smoothing I tend to add rather than subtract if I can..

New table, software changed it..


Old table.. Handmade..


My method is making the unexplored territory in the map extra rich and then taking it away when I get to it, rather than the opposite..

My ignition timing is still just OEM..

CÚdric wrote:

If i were you i would push the enrichment a bit higher up in the boost range. Remember afr 11 at 170kpa is what a standard non intercooled euro engine runs. With intercooler you should be able to run a bit leaner while still being safer, and below that it should be possible to run a bit leaner aswell.. Assuming you arent running ignition that aggressive.

I will try to aim for afr 11 at 200kpa when I'm up and running if its possible, hopefully i can get it a bit leaner below that, if the system will do what i want it to do.


CÚdric wrote:

If i were you i would push the enrichment a bit higher up in the boost range. Remember afr 11 at 170kpa is what a standard non intercooled euro engine runs. With intercooler you should be able to run a bit leaner while still being safer, and below that it should be possible to run a bit leaner aswell.. Assuming you arent running ignition that aggressive.

I will try to aim for afr 11 at 200kpa when I'm up and running if its possible, hopefully i can get it a bit leaner below that, if the system will do what i want it to do.




I see what you mean, move my 11s up to the 200 row.. But where do you think I should be around 145? 100? 75?

Just bump the whole table from 75kpa up about .6 AFR to get there?

My MAP sensor and BOV are on a large port in the TB behind the big buttefly.. Maybe the BOV is letting air in causing a pressure drop there..
My analog boost/vac gauge is tapped directly into the plenum opposite the TB, only inches away.
_________________
80 Turbo - Slightly Modified
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    924Board.org Forum Index -> Performance Upgrades All times are GMT + 11 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9  Next
Page 7 of 9

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group