924Board.org

Rasta Monsta · Joined: 12 Jul 2006 Posts: 11723 Location: PacNW

_________________
Toofah King Bad

WeiBe (1987 924S 2.5t) - 931 S3

fiat22turbo · Joined: 18 Jan 2006 Posts: 4040 Location: Portland, OR

Custom exhaust manifold cracked. Britain has already fixed most of the damage I believe.

https://www.facebook.com/UBootRennenWerks

Video:

http://youtu.be/WKKbzK1JXMQ
_________________
Stefan
1979 924 Carrera GTS (clone-ish)
1988 944 Turbo S (Silver Rose)

emoore924 · Joined: 13 Apr 2004 Posts: 2815

Pretty spectacular....

Fifty50Plus · Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 9:15 am Post subject:

SMH...full up build for a junk race.
_________________
1979 924 NA race car
1982 924 NA race car - Sold
1982 924 Turbo almost a PoS
1981 924 Turbo a real PoS, new engine
1982 924 Turbo nice body, blown engine
1972 911 E race car - going to Vintage
Various 944s to become IT-S race car

Rasta Monsta · Joined: 12 Jul 2006 Posts: 11723 Location: PacNW

Can be totally worth it, especially for a 24. Ever raced at night? Better than sex.
_________________
Toofah King Bad

WeiBe (1987 924S 2.5t) - 931 S3

Grenadiers · Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 6:14 am Post subject:

fiat22turbo · Joined: 18 Jan 2006 Posts: 4040 Location: Portland, OR

Fifty50Plus · Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 11:44 am Post subject:

I think you guys are missing my point. They put together a pretty slick car (minus the chump required crap) and then ran in a kindergarten level race. You can field a team and learn how to do well (or not) in any level of on track competition but chump and lemons mostly lacks quality competitors.
Dave, nothings beats laps but they need to be quality laps. Either get good instruction or run with the best and see how they do it. That's when you improve.
I did my first 24 hour night stint in 1992 and have completed 20 to 30 more 12, 13 and 24 hour races since then. The level of competition is what makes you better, not the doohickies on the roof.
_________________
1979 924 NA race car
1982 924 NA race car - Sold
1982 924 Turbo almost a PoS
1981 924 Turbo a real PoS, new engine
1982 924 Turbo nice body, blown engine
1972 911 E race car - going to Vintage
Various 944s to become IT-S race car

fiat22turbo · Joined: 18 Jan 2006 Posts: 4040 Location: Portland, OR

So have you participated in a Chump or LeMons race?

Or are you just making assumptions?

I've seen some excellent drivers, teams and cars running in ChumpCar and LeMons here on the West Coast.
_________________
Stefan
1979 924 Carrera GTS (clone-ish)
1988 944 Turbo S (Silver Rose)

Rasta Monsta · Joined: 12 Jul 2006 Posts: 11723 Location: PacNW

Wow.
_________________
Toofah King Bad

WeiBe (1987 924S 2.5t) - 931 S3

Fifty50Plus · Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 4:59 pm Post subject:

Stefan,
On the East coast I've seen some SCCA enduro teams dummy down their effort, build a POS (cheater) car and run a Lemons or Chump race and kick ass. They usually get kicked out of the series here because they win too much. Fishing with hand grenades in my opinion. I don't have have a high opinion of what they do or why they do it.
I do think that Chump and Lemons are there as for profit groups that take advantage of everyone's desire to be race car drivers. Requiring uniqueness in car displays (appendages) and team resume stories (fake) as an entry qualifier in place of racing experience is inappropriate.
I was impressed with the quality of the build of their car and question why they chose that event (although listening to all of you maybe that's your only avenue). Talk to your local clubs about money. Forty cars at $800 a pop should be able to get you an SCCA sanctioned event. But then you will need proper driver credentials and medical forms.
A $500 car with four HPDE drivers sharing a car at a weekend event can be a lot of fun. When you begin to believe that it qualifies as a true endurance race, you're mistaken. It's just an endurance experience - often painful in the maintenance department. The better teams make sure that maintenance isn't an issue and then they are in a multi-thousand dollar car. On the East Coast, the only cost difference between an SCCA enduro and one of the others is in tire cost. But then, there is still a big difference in overall skill sets.
Plus the shark fins and clown suits are considered illegal modifications. But then again, that's SCCA.

_________________
1979 924 NA race car
1982 924 NA race car - Sold
1982 924 Turbo almost a PoS
1981 924 Turbo a real PoS, new engine
1982 924 Turbo nice body, blown engine
1972 911 E race car - going to Vintage
Various 944s to become IT-S race car

Grenadiers · Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 12:32 am Post subject:

' When you begin to believe that it qualifies as a true endurance race, you're mistaken'. Like porn stars?

The Boogie Nights of car racing~!
_________________
'83 944 Track car.
'88 924S Track car.
'89 944 Turbo
2004 Winnebago Vectra monster RV
2012 Jeep Wrangler
2014 Kia Soul
2001 Ford F350 powerstroke

Rasta Monsta · Joined: 12 Jul 2006 Posts: 11723 Location: PacNW

I wanted to temper my response, so I let it sit overnight.

Anyone put off by Chuck's elitist diatribe against low buck racing, I would urge you to reconsider.

The finer points of driving represent a tiny, tiny fraction of what can be learned about a successful endurance effort when participating in a 24 hour chump race. The team must efficiently manage fuel stops, driver and tire changes, personal endurance, sleep deprivation, the added stress of racing in the dark, as well as performing rock solid mechanical preparation and paddock repairs. The satisfaction and camaraderie that can be gained from pulling it off cannot be overstated.

Here on the west coat, there are two options to run a 24 hour race, Chump Car and Thunderhill. Putting together a Thunderhill team and learning how to manage an enduro in that environment (at the pace of one shot per year) would indeed be beyond foolish.

There is plenty to learn, and plenty to enjoy at a crap can enduro, and you don't have to be gridded next to Mark Webber to get quality seat time.

I suppose if you live in the most populous area in North America, and have the money and opportunities to just show up and drive someone else's enduro car in a "quality" event, retiring to your Class A RV between your Tom Kristensen-esque stints, more power to you. But, for many that is simply not an option.

So, if you want to give it a try, please do. Unless you are a rare bird indeed, I promise it won't be "beneath you."

Caveat: I have only done Chump, which does not have the odd rules and stunts which have made Lemons famous. I have also not run SCCA, where cheating to win is apparently commonplace.
_________________
Toofah King Bad

WeiBe (1987 924S 2.5t) - 931 S3

skytrooper · Joined: 29 Aug 2007 Posts: 461 Location: Canandaigua, NY

+1 Rasta

These are not Chuck's first comments of this sort. The first couple I kinda blew off, but he just doesn't get it. Nor does he seem willing to try.

I have been racing Chumpcar for years, before that I ran Lemons. I have enjoyed Chumpcar very much and race in both Northern Region (soon to be Chumpcar Canada) and the Eastern Region. I have also raced in SCCA and PCA. I still like Chumpcar better.

It doesn't matter if it is SCCA or Chumpcar, an endurance race is an endurance race. 24 hours is the same in SCCA or any other series. It is stupid to think there really is a difference. The only difference between Chumpcar and the others is cost. I prefer to spend less for the same thrill. Really, that is all it comes down to...how much do you want to spend to race ? But realize that it is indeed racing. Yes, you need less credentials to race in Chumpcar, but the racing is just as intense and exciting. I get more bang for my buck, which means that I get run more races...yay.

Some just will never understand, and maybe it is better that way for the rest of us, as the people at Chumpcar races are also the friendliest I have ever encountered racing.
_________________
Matt

1987 - 924S "Black Pearl"
1982 - BMW 633CSi
1984 - BMW 528e
1983 - 944 N/A "Blue Max" (Gone)
1981 - 931 "Scarlet Harlot" (Gone)
1976 911S Targa (Gone)

Grenadiers · Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 8:00 am Post subject:

I think it's a matter of perspective, and one's history in motorsports. For example, on Pelican, you have several posts on what is the best Porsche, which one would you own, is a 924/944 a true Porsche, blah, blah, blah. Whatever one 'grows' up with is the answer I think. I gravitate back to the water cooled cars all the time.

Here is my former life, modified '91 Jeep Wrangler, did all the work myself, lockers, Dana 44 in front, Ford 9" in the rear, spring over axle, '88 Mustang HO 302, Ford T-18 tranny. We were just as serious about four-wheeling as Chuck is about racing, and his heritage. We were the 'experts' and poo-pood the noobs asking about 2" lifts and other poser questions. And we were quite snobbish about it! However, after a few years, as those of us serious four-wheelers started to drop out, or moved on, those poser guys became more welcome into our club, metaphorically speaking. Any sport needs new blood, and avenues to attain it. Chumpcar, SCCA, NASA, etc., all serve that purpose.
Pritchett Canyon, Moab, Ut.

_________________
'83 944 Track car.
'88 924S Track car.
'89 944 Turbo
2004 Winnebago Vectra monster RV
2012 Jeep Wrangler
2014 Kia Soul
2001 Ford F350 powerstroke