924Board.org

[gwsg]

Just watching the evening news to see that Rupert Murdoch has gained approval from his Australian shareholders to re-list News Ltd [ an Australian company] in Delaware and to trade on the US stock market. So what?

Some of you remember the discussion on this board during the Iraq war and the richness of the discussion and how people from all around the world got to hear the opinions of others and express their own. Well now it’s crunch time and I may have left this posting too late but you yanks have to vote in less than a week and most of you are probably not even registered.

In Oz we will be watching a horse race, the Melbourne Cup a public holiday in Melbourne, but that’s OK because 3 weeks ago 98% of us voted on a Saturday and returned the incumbent Prime Minister, John Howard. This was the cause for some of us on this board to consider emigration. But no matter , all of the people have spoken, so who can argue with that? We live in a liberal democracy.

What about the US? You’re satisfied if you get more than a 40% turn out and then a lot of the votes aren’t counted any way. You’ve supposedly gone to war to bring democracy to the oppressed but you don’t practice it yourselves. For a democracy to survive it requires the participation of it’s populace or else it is just dictatorship; in your case, the Government of the Corporations.

MY POLL IS: HOW MANY OF YOU ARE REGISTERED TO VOTE? wdb are you registered? stu2j are you registered? All you people who have expressed strong patriotic opinions are you registered? Democracy is much more than an American flag stuck on your dash or your web site. Democracy demands participation or it does not exist.

My elder daughter has lived in NY for the past 4 years and amongst all of her American friends not one has ever voted.

This blows my mind in that young Australians look forward to the the time when they can vote. Sort of a ‘Rights of Passage’ thing. My youngest daughter is engaged to an American from Georgia who had no interest in politics until he moved to Australia and saw the effect that the people can have on a government. He has registered for the first time, even though he likes none of the candidates, because in a democracy you can throw out somebody who has stuffed up even if you don’t like the next guy. In fact it’s a good warning to the next guy!

As Porschev says: Opinions are like assholes, everybody’s got one!

I say show the rest of us democratic nations that you are still one of us.

Cheers

Geoff
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My 80 924 loves me.

[Sleykin]

Already mailed my ballot off.
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Glenn Neff
Medford, OR
87' 924S

[Stu2j]

>>>What about the US? You’re satisfied if you get more than a 40% turn out and then a lot of the votes aren’t counted any way.

In this election, we will have better than a 50% turnout. I think the turnout would be much higher if it weren't for the polls. For instance, in my state of VA, we always vote Republican and because of the electoral college process of all or nothing, a lot of folks don't bother to vote if the polls clearly suggest that the state vote is going a certain way.

ALL votes that are legally cast in a US election are counted. I don't know why you believe otherwise.

>>>You’ve supposedly gone to war to bring democracy to the oppressed but you don’t practice it yourselves.

Supposedly?!? Did you see what just happened in Afghanistan? One has to recognize that the choice not to vote is still a choice.

>>>in your case, the Government of the Corporations.

Please.

>>>stu2j are you registered?

Of course I'm registered and I will be at the polls when they open Nov 2. Even my daughter will vote in the "kid vote" (btw, the kid vote has successfully predicted the outcome of every election since its inception).

Have a good one.
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-Stu
924 owner since 1988
924S owner since 2002
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[Lizard]

Stu2j, you havent seen Farenhiet 9/11 have you?

it explains his comments about votes counting, also about Afghanistan
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3 928s,

[Stu2j]

>>>Stu2j, you havent seen Farenhiet 9/11 have you?

No. I wouldn't put one dime into that lying scumbags pocket.

If one is getting their information from Micheal Moore, then one will always be as ignorant as Michael Moore.
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-Stu
924 owner since 1988
924S owner since 2002
Click here to view them:

[Lizard]

[Stu2j]

>>>it is a movie that everyone should watch imo

I suppose you actually believe the Governor of California is really a robot from the future and that everyone should watch The Terminator in order to get "accurate" information about the Governor.

I recommend that folks use their minds rather than have it made up for them by someone like Michael Moore who has as his agenda everything but the truth.

Folks like Michael Moore are perfectly willing to watch innocent people be slaughtered around the world but let someone try to cut down a tree or say a prayer and listen to him scream.

Michael Moore was yelling and screaming that we should remove the bombing range in Puerto Rico. Well, it's gone and the base is being closed. What did it do to that local economy there? Do you think Michael Moore gives a damn or is helping the folks now devastated by his "help".

This is the problem with these idiots who like to yell and complain over every issue with a shortsighted and isolationist view of the world and complete lack of grasp of the actual facts.

When are folks going to wake up......
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-Stu
924 owner since 1988
924S owner since 2002
Click here to view them:

[CMXXXI]

I registered to vote back in '74 and have participated in every Presidential and Congressional election since, thank you very much.

I honestly think that because of the electoral college process ("all or nothing" as Stu2j puts it), many don't vote as they don't see their vote making a difference. I personally think the process sucks big time - it's not truly representative of the people's choice.
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'79 Eurospec 931

[Stu2j]

>>>I personally think the process sucks big time - it's not truly representative of the people's choice.

I used to despise the electoral college process and then I changed my mind because if it didn't exist, the candidates would focus almost entirely on CA and NY and simply ignore states like OH (now a critical state in this election). (I don't believe CA and NY accurately represent the rest of the country ).

I am now of the opinion that Colorado may have the right idea. Allocating the electoral votes in proportion to the popular vote. It puts the electorate somewhat in line with the popular vote while retaining an incentive for the candidates to focus on the smaller states where they could pick up a larger portion of electoral votes.

My fear (if you could call it that) with this election is smply that it will follow the precedent set by Al Gore and wind up back in the courts.
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-Stu
924 owner since 1988
924S owner since 2002
Click here to view them:

[Khal]

Withdrawn
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'80 924 Turbo

[numbbers]

Already voted for George. He is not a perfect president, but much better than the socialist Kerry would be. If we had Kerry in office, we would be just like the rest of the world.
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1980 924 Turbo

[wdb]

yeah , you can register whenever you renew your drivers liscense .my first try at voting when I was 18 . I was met at the door to the comm. college , by 2 well dressed women and a clip board . they asked my name and flipped through the papers on the clipboard .then told me I'm not on the list and I cant vote there , I have to find the correct district so I can vote .realizing its election day and everything is closed , I thought well I missed this 1 . next time . no one told me to look out for crooked republicans scaming at the polls . I fell for it . my next attempt , I didnt know I had to register again after moving and you have to be registered by, I think its oct 4 , to vote .third try was the charm, city election .

yeah but there are problems with our current systems . like alot of people dont know the " Presidential debate Commission . " which runs the pres. debates is actually a privately owned corporation . thats is owned wholely by the Democratic and Republican Parties . the format ,questions ,and modertors are chosen in advance by the parties , the " TWO " candidats are not allowed to ask each other any questions (they sometimes forget ) , if there not questioning each other , technically thats not a debate . they once invited a martian to the debate , but he kept making wierd sucking noises , so they stoped inviting people . alan keyes thought he was invited and the police took him away in handcuffs , kicking and scraming the whole way for trying to crash the party , ralph nader was not even allowed to watch the debate from the audience and he had a ticket , state police said we were warned you were coming and were told , send him away . no Public Citizens allowed

the fact you have to register 6 weeks before voting, theres no reason you cant register the day of the election . the dems and reps have put a 1000 hurdles in the way of third parties , in each of the 50 states . etc etc.

eventually we'll be able to vote online , and that will increase turnout to as many people as have computers , currently around 50% do . but then things are going to get intesting . when our Constitution was written everybody couldnt go to washington to vote on important issues , so we have representatives in washington to vote for us . soon we will be able to vote for ourselves ,and they wont be needed to vote for us , or we will be ableto vote on bills etc and they will have to abide by our vote . I'll bet it will be a smooth transision . I dont think it will be that hard to get a 600 plus reps to vote in favore of eliminating there jobs

oh and this is a Republic , small technicality . democracy is mob rule . here " the will of the many , shall not crush the rights of the few " well its supposed to be that way , alot would argue the point .

[kye]

while i'm not going to get into the debate about what kind of state US politics is in (which seems to be quite obvious to me), I am interested by what wdb said about being able to vote directly across the net..
that certainly changes many of the underlying principals of the reprasentative system!

I have recently seen a number of documentaries that were food for thought, none quite as significant as a doco about Noam Chomsky called Manufacturing Consent, which I highly recommend. He talks about the role of the media in relation to democracy as set out in the US constitution, and the discussion touches on different kinds of democracy and governance.
Being able to directly vote in an organised manner would open up the situation to any level of representation, even to the point of having a direct democracy if that was wanted. it's certainly an interesting thought..
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it's funny, but when they said "Anything is Possible", that's exactly what they meant....

[Stu2j]

>>>I watched two documentaries last night; One on SBS about the political history of Dubbya and Kerry

That's "President" or Mr. Bush and "Senator" or Mr. Kerry. It's a shame that folks can't disagree and still show some amount of respect for the office held.

I can assure you that nobody who rises to the office of the President of the United States is "ignorant" or "dumb". President Bush is just less "polished" than most politicians. It is an attribute that many Americans actually find refreshing.

Mr. Kerry has a long record as a tax and spend liberal. He is a secular socialist, a pacifist and an isolationist (this is why secular nations like him). He has made a lot of "promises" in his campaign (basically, he has promised everything to everybody) but his record is somewhat dismal at best.

The good news is that even if Mr. Kerry wins, we are almost certainly going to retain a Republican Congress. The bad news is that the next President will appoint Supreme Court judges and we have enough Godless judges sitting on the bench.
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-Stu
924 owner since 1988
924S owner since 2002
Click here to view them:

[Stu2j]

>>>while i'm not going to get into the debate about what kind of state US politics is in (which seems to be quite obvious to me)

I wish you would go ahead and elaborate. It's not so obvious to everyone what is going on and I'm always curious as to "outsiders" views.
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-Stu
924 owner since 1988
924S owner since 2002
Click here to view them: